Stacy Summary: Why do you think Gordon Brown sold half of the UK’s gold supply at the multi-decade low? And do you think the manner of the disposal was an intended to get the lowest price or was just sheer incompetence? By the way, I am making a film about this and have some awesome footage shot over the past year and will be listing it on PirateMyFilm as soon as it is up and running.
- ‘No pirates allowed’ in Somalia (still welcome on Wall Street)
- UK prepares for 3rd wave of banking crisis with injection of £50 billion (h/t Mike/Liverpool)
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Launches competitor to World Bank
Hugo Chávez ‘idea of creating an alternative to the IMF is now reality.
Finance ministers from seven South American countries signed Friday an agreement to create a new bank.
Banco del Sur (South Bank) was Venezuelas President Hugo Chávez ‘idea. He sees the bank as a counterweight to the influence of IMF and World Bank.
At the meeting in Buenos Aires was the finance ministers from Brazil, Argentina, Venezuela, Uruguay, Ecuador, Paraguay and Bolivia agreed to give the bank an initial capital of 7 billion dollars (46 Milliarder Kroner).
Argentina, Brazil and Venezuela put up the 2 billion each, while the smaller countries, putting in the rest.
Each country shall have one vote each in the bank’s board, and plans are ready to start up projects to a value of 70 million dollars. (© NTB)(www.dn.no)
Sorry no English link.
Max/Stacy
Did you read this?
http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2009/may/08/bank-england-recession-economy
Mike
thanks Palantiri,
It is on msnbc now:
Chavez and allies challenge IMF, World Bank
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22171566/
oops, no it’s not, sorry that story is 100o years old
This has been going on for sometime, China has been paying off IMF loans & getting into Afica/South America/Central America
You know all they have to do now is wait, not long.
)
Mike
here is an english link: http://www.businessweek.com/ap/financialnews/D982BVRO0.htm
maybe it is an old story as you say snoop diddy but to me it looked like they finally closed the negotiation and signed the deal yesterday. effectivly starting the bank.
Thanks Stacy
I promise to leave You & Max alone for awhile now
Mike
I can hardly wait until pirate my film is up and running. It’s such a cool idea. Doubt I’ll be able to help finance anything seeing as I don’t have a credit card. But still.
The surging loonie story comes from a paper that I’m embarrassed operates out of my country. I follow it for the sheer absurdity of its coverage and to know what webs are being weaved. They try to appear like a legitimate paper with a forum but ‘sensitive’ articles typically don’t allow comments. Also, dig deep with a comment on one of their ‘safe’ shill pieces and it’s mysteriously bumped into oblivion. IE the shill piece itself is longer linked from readily seen pages on their site. I guess it’s a sort of compliment when you can comment and see the article vanish within 15 minutes. I was considering cross-commenting from ‘safe’ articles to dig at their shoddy Afghan war coverage, and financial crime-crisis coverage, but I’m pretty sure they’d just IP ban/block me.
If you want to know what bankers want you to believe, the globe and mail is for you. It’s Canada’s Fox News.
Cal ee for nee ah. Its fantastic. May economic Summary. http://sco.ca.gov/Press-Releases/2009/05-09summary.pdf
Woops sales taxes collection down 50.9%, income taxes down 43.6%. Answer legalize pot and tax it.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2009/05/07/EDF817FP7A.DTL
Stacy,
Re: your question over Gordon Brown’s motivations for selling gold at the bottom. My guess: the banksters ordered him to do so in order to keep the price of gold low.
Here is a very good link re: gold at Fort Knox not being audited for many decades:-
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/article5989271.ece
At the end of the article there are a few pieces referring to conspiracy theories about aliens and FEMA camp in the US. Don’t know if these were put in to give the main article less credibility, certainly people who have commented on the article seem to think so.
re: Insiders selling = Rats leaving the ship. This gives them some cash.
Question: what are they buying? Gold, Oil. If we could follow the money then we’d know what they are thinking.
Wow! Just found a brilliant site. Well worth checking out if you’re interested in TRUTH!
http://www.iamthewitness.com/
“When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.” – Thomas Jefferson
“When the people and the government fear Goldman Sachs, there is economic dictatorship that will destroy the very fabric of our existence as a civilized society.” – Mike Morgan
Check out:-
http://www.goldmansachs666.com/
@Stacy:
Why did Gordon Brown sell England’s gold at the lowest price?
Ask Baron de Rothschild.
I think Gordon Brown sold half of the UK’s gold supply at the multi-decade low because he never really understood that economy is a science that has its basic axioms much like any other science and what makes those axioms so elusive to grasp for some people like him is that they have nothing to do with confidence. There is no really excuse for him, because with his act he also showed that he didn’t really pay attention to history, distant and most current. Because if he did, he would be able to see that the irrational exuberance of the nineties was a great new bubble of the twentieth century that would ultimately have its inevitable burst. If he did, he would understand that gold had an intrinsic value that was eternal and couldn’t be distorted with all of the vagaries of the Keynesian business cycles for the last 90 years.
I think his act was sheer incompetence, because I believe the banking oligarchs understand gold for what it is. Like you mentioned a couple of times “they hate gold”, and I like to add “with a passion”. So they understand their enemy and they would never sell gold without a strategic plan to keep the price of gold under control, like IMF is probably doing now, keeping it under $1000.
Special Edition with Eric King & Guests
Listen to the 3rd Hour
Part 1
Dr. Anna Schwartz, Economist
http://www.financialsense.com/fsn/main.html
Dr. Anna Schwartz is one of the most respected authorities on Monetary Policy
Excellent report IMO !
I’m with Rich. He sold it to the Rothschilds, announcing it in advance so they could get it even cheaper.
With regard to Brown selling the gold, I think Vlado is on the mark. A “Barbarous Relic” was the Keynesian Anthem. So in his ‘defense’ he is/was probably just ignorant.
With the Canadian peso, here was an announcement by the Bank of Canada on May 6. http//www.cbc/money/strory/2009/05/06/carney-senate-committee.html
So with Canada not engaging in the Q.E., it just means that it won’t sink as fast as U.S., U.K., EU.. New Zealand and Australia might even be in a better position than Canada. (Higher rates and no Q.E.) So as far as “fundamentals” go; this may be a clue.
whoops,
http://www.cbc.ca/money/story/2009/05/06/carney-senate-committee.html
Brown does what he is told. In order for successful world government the slaves of all nations must be semi-equal. USA & GB need to come down a few notches. Simple but sad.
There is good information that Goldman Sachs bought the Gold!
Also everyone wants to know WHY did Gordon insist that the BOE would report ahead of time they were about to sell another load of it………….thus driving down the price?
BTW the “Gold” thats left is starting to “Decay”…….it was a shippment “Sold” to Britian in the 1930′s at a time of ecomoince distress………..The Bars are cracking & turning GREEN.
Mike
GoldSeek — WHEN GORDON BROWN SOLD BRITAIN’S GOLD
Snippet:
“In 1999, it was rumored that investment bank Goldman Sachs had a 1,000 ton gold short position in the markets. However, much to the shock of Goldman Sachs and the central bankers, in 1999 gold stopped falling; and, because Goldman Sachs’ short position was so large, Goldman possibly could suffer catastrophic losses. This is when England’s then Chancellor of the Exchequer, Gordon Brown, on May 8, 1999 announced England would sell over 50% of its gold reserves, 415 tons of the most precious metal on earth at the very bottom of the market. The decision to sell England’s gold thereby saved Goldman Sachs and insured the political future of Gordon Brown. Goldman Sachs’ is still in business and Gordon Brown is now the Prime Minister of England. Selling a nation’s gold to save the bankers’ parasitic system is now common practice as the banker’s system continues to collapse and gold continues to rise.”
Oh Boy! That is a huge question. I have not monitored Gordon’s activities closely over the years so I can not comment to any effect on the question.
I will only add that gold investors come in two flavors the profit driven and the survival driven. If the gold was purchased at a low it would only make sense to sell at a high if there was no impending “doom and gloom”. For the survivalist it would be tough to sell at any price even if a nice profit was to be realized.
@Mike-liverpool
Gold does not oxidize (tarnish, discolor, tone or crack); at least it is my understanding that it doesn’t. Maybe it was not .999 and the copper in it is oxidizing.
@Don,
That is my understanding of pure gold as well. Maybe they were inflation bars.
In the old days, it was easier to spot inflation; because one of the few ways to “create” more money was to add non precious metals to the gold. (ie. lead) Since lead is next to gold on the periodic table, they displace the same amount of water, rendering that test ineffective. This is where biting gold coins originated. It you bit a gold coin and it marked too easy, it was split with lead. (I guess if you went blind, that might be a hint too.)
I bet Olympians don’t know they’re doing a lead test.
1) Perhaps, much of the present, worldwide gloom has been oversubscribed. It may be possible that the major media is susceptible to a bout of recency bias in their reporting. Unfolding characteristics of a leading nature seem to suggest that this is the case.
The Baltic dry Index is now trending upwards, implying a that a recovery in global trade is in process. Further, the credit crisis seems to be moderating as per persistent declines in LIBOR and the TED spread.
The SPX, FTSE, CAC, DAX, NIKK, and SSEC security indices are all well off their lows and are, at least, in a bear market rally. The extent of the next significant reaction, which is imminent, will tell us if we are to remain victims of the bear, or riders of a newly born bull.
2) All monetary systems that ever existed (including gold standards) have failed – excepting the current regime [which is likely on its way out]. The failures were replaced with new financial orders which lead to renewed liquidity, then, as anomalies accumulated over time, they became failures themselves, etc.
Monetary history tells us that a gold standard was certainly no one’s idea of economic Nirvana. While gold provided a store of value for those who owned it (most folks didn’t and still don’t), it also fueled boom and bust cycles under which the common person oft suffered grinding poverty.
My favourite economist, Wilhelm Röpke, wrote, in his description of the trade cycle, “If there is a boom in an economically important country, it is synonymous with an expansionof the supply of credit and with a tendency to drive up prices. The trade balance becomes unfavourable, gold flows out, and starts a similar tendency, to an expansion of credit in the country receiving the gold.” [Röpke, W. (1936). Crises and cycles. London: William Hodge & Company, Limited.]
A present day return to some form of gold standard could only be made possible by the confiscation of all gold in private hands. Neither the US, the UK, or any other government treasury holds significant quantities of gold relative to the total quantity outstanding. Identity of the world’s real largest holders of gold is not available. Just whom would a return to a gold standard truly benefit? I do not believe that the answer to that question is either you or me.
@jurgenwahl,
I don’t understand the logic of your arguement. Your favorite economist said it was the expansion of CREDIT, that lead to boom and bust. And if you’re taking counterfeit pieces of paper for gold; I wonder why gold gets drained away?
I would say the gold standard didn’t fail, it was ditched. Imagine going from issuing receipts of paper for the gold that you have, to a system where you can issue any amount you desire. (Sounds like a sytem of boom and bust to me).
Under a fiat currency system you need regulation. (strong argument for government involvement and/or a central bank) Since it’s just a counterfeit system, you can’t let everyone print their own money. But if there was a return to gold, this wouldn’t be needed. All you would really need is a scale.
I’m sorry, but your arguments are non-sequiturs.
@William,
interesting tid bits. I always thought biting gold coins was simply to see if it was soft, but it might reveal lead as well. Good stuff.
Dishonest and stupid, and thats not just Brown
To: @William.
Just a few pertinent quotes in re. gold as money.
“The great fault of the international gold standard… was that it tended to cause deflation and unemployment in countries with an excess of imports over exports.”
“A gold standard requires that a nation, usually through its monetary authority, stand ready to buy and sell gold at a price fixed in terms of its domestic currency. When a nation is importing more goods than it is exporting, gold tends to go abroad to offset the unfavorable balance of trade. If the deficit in exports continues for a time, a wholesale loss of gold can be prevented only if the monetary authority takes positive steps to protect the national stock of gold. The theory of the gold standard is that the drain on gold will cause prices to fall in the deficit nation, and the influx of gold will cause prices to rise in the country with a surplus of exports.”
“To rescue the gold standard in a deficit nation… means to sacrifice control of the domestic rate of interest; it means a reduction in investment, employment, and income via high interest rates; it means deflation at home, which… involves an attempt to lower costs in home industries to the point where they will be able to compete on favorable terms in foreign markets; it means pressure to reduce wage rates as a means for getting lower costs of production… it probably means industrial strife, strikes, and interrupted production. After all these painful adjustments, the gold standard may be saved but at a price which no nation can afford to pay.”
“Keynes concluded… that unemployment and deflation, the inevitable consequences of the gold standard… were evils which far outweighed the advantages of the gold standard.”
The above quotes are from pages 286-287 of, [Dillard, D. (1948). "The economics of John Maynard Keynes: The theory of a monetary economy." New York: Prentice-Hall, Inc.]
(If you don’t particularly like these quotations, let me know, and I can provide many other sources, although most are somewhat more technical.)
Under a gold standard, in historical writings, one finds a constant complaint of no money in circulation, despair, and grinding poverty in advanced nations. Modern day economists fear deflation much more than inflation – both you and I should, also. This is why gold was, as you say, “ditched” as a monetary base – its operation caused alternating waves of systemic inflation and DEFLATION. But so were all of the previous monetary systems “ditched” for the fact that they no longer functioned – in other words, they failed.
As to your “credit” versus “gold” argument, although credit is ultimately based upon trust, in actuality it is based upon trust, future resources with which to pay, hope for beneficial future prospects, erroneous assumptions, attempts to capitalise upon manias, etc. An inflow of gold to a nation’s treasury always resulted in an inflationary change in prices – unless the inflow was sterilised. Unfortunately, the inflow was seldom sterilised because of politicians wanting to take credit (in sundry forms) for the ensuing boom times – and forget about tomorrow. This is why the correct name for “economics” is “political economy.” Political decisions pervade monetary policy at all times, everywhere. That is one reason why anomalies occur in every monetary regime and ultimately make the system inoperative.
Gold, no – a non-debt, fiat system, yes!
@juergenwahl
Current events are about to show you that Keynes and his “political economic” reasonings are faulty.
Thank you for the quick lesson in “Animal Spirits” and “liquidity traps”.
Here are a couple of links that may help you out.
http://mises.org/story/3169
http://mises.org/etexts/hoppekeynes.pdf
I forgot; if you add to your argument that I have control over the printing press (debt or non-debt fiat system) then I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU.
He sold the gold at the behest of the U.S Treasury ( Rubin {ex-Goldman} and Summers) in order to keep long term interest rates artificially low. Larry Summers, who took over at Treasury from Rubin, did extensive research about Gibson’s Paradox. Gibson’s Paradox stated that when real long term interest rates decreased the gold price would rise in order to keep monetary expansion in check as the rising gold price would pressure bond yields higher in order to keep monetary expansion in check. Summers deducted that if gold prices could be kept down or even going lower as long term interest rates or yields dropped they could cheat this natural monetary phenomenom. By cheating the natural laws of economics they (U.S. and U.K policy makers) could keep interest rates lower than they should be and also keep the credit bubble going for longer than it should. One can find a lot about Gibson’s Paradox and Larry Summers work on http://www.goldensextant.com
So Brown was told to sell the gold to support low interest rates ala Gibsons paradox.
Was Fort Knox looted for the same reason?
How did the Chinese accumulate so much?
To: @William.
Thanks for the recommended links. I will give them a try.
Regards
It certainly seems a little off topic but I felt I had to respond to Kass
(I misplaced the K wi’ a H)
and no-one seems to have picked up on my debunk of that video on cell phones he posted.
Yet I wish to stress, how important bees are to the survival of our food chain and ultimately ourselves. Finance is involved somehow.
The Moray (Scotland) beekeeper Marion Lang is one of the few to poke her nose above the parapet.
http://inthesenewtimes.com/2009/05/11/moray-beekeeper-marion-lang-bees-the-perfect-murder/
Sorry I feel like an idiot. My last post was a mistake. The dates on the article conflicted with the date on one of the links and I got confused . I thought it was more recent. I have since deleted the page but there is a link
on this page here.
http://inthesenewtimes.com/2009/05/09/concerns-grow-for-future-of-wild-honey-bees/
My sincerest apologies.