Stacy Summary: We look at the latest scandals of downgrading America, investors seeking security in gold, bank profit abominations and federal ponzis. In the second half of the show, Max talks to Stefan Molyneux of Freedomain Radio about the Canadian economy and housing bubble, the oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico and how to fix the world.
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First 2 say Stacy looks extra good today
Why We Can’t Rely on Foreign Consumers to Rescue American Jobs, and Why Today’s “Jobs for America Summit” Is a Bad Joke http://www.huffingtonpost.com/robert-reich/why-we-cant-rely-on-forei_b_646242.html
Warren Buffett. Just another mercantilist: http://www.thedailybell.com/714/Mercantilism.html Nobody gets that wealthy without using the price-fixing power of the “government”.
‘Warren Buffett is the primary beneficiary of Law and Financial based capitalism, no capitalism at all. Buffet is able to have regulations crafted to his business plan as needed and in advance of his strategic decisions. AIG gets a bailout and Buffetts reinsurance business is saved.. Buy a railroad right of way and have the regulation needed to build it out play into your hands, also have the financing show up mysteriously at your front door.’
Warren Pollock — No President Left Behind
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ajZ8V4zh8c
great show guys.
There is something vaguely smart ass about this character – underneath his logical exterior I believe he is just working off another belief system heroine trip.
Humans react to coercion within a group – it is one of the defining traits of our sorry primate existence.
Please no more interviews with adolescents who failed to grow up.
Primate dynamics is a reality we have to learn to modify, these pathetic libertarian dream factories have never existed in reality and never will.
Regarding incentives, the only solution is highly progressive taxation to put more money in the hands of consumers and less money in the hands of speculators. With more money in the hands of consumers they could buy a few politicians like the speculators do now. Eliminate the income tax on anyone making less than the average income. Institute a transaction tax on all financial transactions. This would bring accumulated capital in balance with the need for capital to fund real productive enterprise. Right now accumulated capital dwarfs the need for capital, reducing the return on capital. This causes money managers to leverage to extreme, hide risk with complicated derivatives, and stimulate the growth of debt through reckless schemes. The most stable and equal period in the country’s history was when top tax rates were above 90%. People forget why this was necessary.
Roubini Urges Obama Push For More Stimulus To Boost ‘Fragile Recovery’ http://forum.prisonplanet.com/index.php?topic=179740.0
Great show!
A little Molyneux philosophy:
Freedomain Radio — #1419 Ego Death? (MP3)
Gisted — The true self conforms to reason and evidence. The false self conforms to bullying irrationalities. The false self arises from the fear of personal death and from the threat of biological ostracism. The need for co-operation enables the tribe to enforce its whims upon the individual in return for protection. We survive the humiliation of being controlled by earnestly believing our conformity is a virtue because if we act as if it’s just submission to power, those who inflict the false self will know that we’re faking if and won’t share the benefits of conformity. The false self displaces the true self as a rational adaptation for survival because if we reject the irrationalities of the tribe, we won’t survive. When you reach out with your true self, you provoke the humiliation of people’s conformity and they attack you because to reveal their false self really feels like dying to them because it was the fear of death that originally provoked their conformity to the tribe.
http://www.freedomainradio.com/Traffic_Jams/FDR_1419_ego_death.mp3
Some Parents Are Now Stealing Their Children’s Credit (VIDEO) http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/07/14/parents-are-stealing-thei_n_646134.html
Why Aren’t Jobs Coming Back? The White House Isn’t Saying http://www.huffingtonpost.com/simon-johnson/david-axelrods-talking-po_b_646091.html
Voters Say To Hell With Deficit Reduction, Help The Unemployed http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/07/14/unemployment-deficit-polls-voters_n_646600.html?ir=Business
of one heart and of one soul
@Youri Carma
>> Parents Are Now Stealing Their Children’s Credit
Damn! And in addition to all those government health ‘care’ and pension entitlements they’ve indebted their children with.
Is an intergenerational war brewing?
‘I hope America will grow up before it grows old. Its important for older Americans to give our children and grandchildren the same unburdened economic opportunities we had. The demographic time bomb is ticking. Now is the time to defuse it.’
http://www.atouchofgrey.com/warinter.html
Higher education fund buys gold over economic worries
AUSTIN — Fearing unstable international financial markets and the possibility of high inflation, Texas’ higher education investment managers have bought more than $500 million in gold.
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/business/7108909.html
Lots of passion from your guest but far too much fluff. A dreamer of singing meadows.
A ponzi scheme paying 8 to 10 percent a year? I have been able to better that! I have been heavily invested in gold and related things since 2002. Gold has been going up an average of 15% per year for the past decade. Just luck you say! All I had to realize is that when the FED (Feudal Reserve Bank) sets its overnight lending rate to less than inflation it is time to get out of paper assets and into commodities. When the price of an ounce of gold can buy the DOW it is time to sell the gold and get into stocks and bonds once again. Gee, isn’t that easy?
For all those statists out there, remember “MONEY IS NOT WEALTH”
Usefull stuff is wealth. To quote Madeline Kahn in the movie “The Jerk” when she was crying about loosing everything, “it’s not the money, it’s the stuff”
Feel like the Rooster today
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gHiR1xeOSs&feature=related
Molyneux is a crank.
First, everything he said about foreign help being denied due to archaic laws has been debunked. Even a CNBC talking head shot down this one. The Jones Act is NOT being applied in the Gulf to prevent foreign ships from helping.
See:
http://www.wmfe.org/site/News2?page=NewsArticle&id=10745&news_iv_ctrl=1041
http://mediamatters.org/research/201006230019
http://www.factcheck.org/2010/06/oil-spill-foreign-help-and-the-jones-act/
Second, he does not seem to understand that liberty without justice is slavery, and that the libertarian utopia is, in fact, corporate feudalism. Indeed, the founders of modern libertarianism are also the architects of neoliberalism, which has led to our governments being owned by corporate oligarchs.
Leaving aside his reliance on faulty assumptions and outright falsehoods, he is still correct that something must be done. But what he proposes to fix it is lunacy, and one of the primary reasons that we find ourselves where we are today is because we started down the libertarian path by pursuing the neoliberal policies of libertarian guru Milton Friedman.
Again, liberty without justice is not liberty but slavery. History shows us that the law cannot ensure liberty by merely compensating somebody for its loss after the fact, as things like the law is intended to do, sometimes justice can only be achieved by preventing the impairment to liberty from ever happening. In the market, that means that regulation is sometimes required to ensure that the market is a truly free one.
Unfortunately, our regulatory system now is a farce and relies far too heavily on the decisions of government bureaucrats who are bought and paid for by the industries they are supposed to regulate. To move us towards a working market economy again, we need to decentralize that regulatory power and empower market participants to enforce the rules quickly and easily in way that also moves us towards a truly “self-regulating” market.
To all those Non -statists out there I have one word that would/should strike fear into your hearts.
Tamerlane.
He spared no one during the siege of Baghdad.
Money or possessions mean nothing to the dead.
A great centre of learning was destroyed possibly by ineffectual dreamers who cared nothing for defence or cohesion.
Extreme Libertarians have never created a society because it cannot defend itself against forces that abhor a power vacuum
I think its important to distinguish between virtual currency’s that operate within games and social networking for virtual items and virtual currency’s that are alternative digital currency’s to exchange with in commerce.
However I would totally support facebook if they rolled out their virtual currency’s to be used as an actual currency to compete with the dollar and euro and have nothing to do with activity on facebook if they done it as a sister website similar to dibspace which is beginning to create an abundance of wealth for all who are involved.
Do You FEEL it … the anger … cause it’s freight trains and there commin. OH YAAA!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEL6_SuQCu8&feature=related
Britain’s debt four times higher than previously acknowledged
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/britainrsquos-debt-the-untold-story-2025979.html
The true scale of Britain’s national indebtedness was laid bare by the Office for National Statistics yesterday: almost £4 trillion, or £4,000bn, about four times higher than previously acknowledged.
22 Statistics That Prove The Middle Class Is Being Systematically Wiped Out Of Existence In America (freight trains are a commin)
Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/22-statistics-that-prove-the-middle-class-is-being-systematically-wiped-out-of-existence-in-america-2010-7#83-percent-of-all-us-stocks-are-in-the-hands-of-1-percent-of-the-people-1#ixzz0tmHQELTN
@WL – good find
@Youri – re: parents stealing their children’s credit! omg; I think Max suggested something like this would hapen; crazy
@Dork – yes, we were saying something similar on our way back from dinner here in Angers; crossing the bridge which was first built around 1080, the tourist info stated that the river used to have chains going across it to keep out invaders; and you look at the entire history of Europe until it coalesced into the modern nation-states, it was just two or three thousand years of wars and invasions and property theft, rape and pillage; it seems that men are inclined to form groups that raid and seize, it seems like without some sort of organized law it would become something like this again? I don’t know, just saying that wherever you go in Europe, it seems to be this story; and, of course, the Amerindians had all their lands taken from them in the name of ‘higher’ civilizations and religions of the organized nation states (only after the Aztec and Inca empires took from the smaller tribes); while personally I would prefer a far, far more voluntary structure than what we have, I’m not sure that voluntarism would suit the weak or those that don’t want to constantly defend themselves from violence and invasion; but we’re going to talk to Stefan more about this at greater length on On the Edge soon; it’s a very interesting discussion at this cross road in history
@Dork
I agree with you. Only the power of the modern state can stand up to the financial oligarchs and the entrenched corruption. Sure the government itself is stinking with corruption but this must be replaced also. The further diminishing and ridicule of state powers only plays into the hands of the kleptocrats. Only the modern state has the power to push back.
Don’t destroy it; change it.
I would say that countries with social systems in place are very ready to ride out the storms. Your example should be Sweden. And, like Sweden, Canada is ready for negative repo’s. This is how the system gets reset. The commercial banks won’t like it, though.
Its the countries which rely almost exclusively on a formula derived from interest rates, and aggregate demand from bonds which are in serious trouble.
To say that Canada has the worst debt problem in the world is a wild exaggeration and complete nonsense. Nobody has an inkling of the real numbers, since they are kept under wraps.
Chinese workers wage increases but deceptive façade by John Chan (google trans from Dutch) http://tinyurl.com/39vay48
@Y’all
Didn’t I hear Mr. Molyneux say “come see the violence inherent in the system!”
BULL SHIT ….. BULL SHIT …… BULL SHIT …….. BULL SHIT
Government is to blame ….. yah right this guy does not know what the consequences of his ideas will be.
These problems are all due to corporations and the GOP
Criminals paying of their Crimes with your stolen money LOL
Goldman, SEC Discuss Catch-All Settlement http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704746804575367532286867918.html?mod=googlenews_wsj
@Stacy / Danny
To my mind the American extreme libertarian philosophy worked to some extent as the geographical isolation it experienced prevented it from fully dealing with other cultures.
This is both Americas strength and weakness.
And if you know both you can use its weakness to destroy its strength by posing false libertarian / conservative views as happened during the Reagan era and beyond.
Stefan Molyneux : Great Guest.
…. speaks the truth about Govt.
ca. @17:50 – 18:00
ca. 19:37 – 20:21
ca. 21:50 – 22:22
… and Especially :
23:00 – 24:31 ( The Gun in the Room )
… and
25:45 – 26:30 ( The Solution)
@Gordo …..”These problems are all due to corporations and the GOP”
… and the #1 reason : the willingness of Govt. to comply !!!!
The destruction of the American middle class, it will take generations to make it come back (if ever)
http://www.businessinsider.com/22-statistics-that-prove-the-middle-class-is-being-systematically-wiped-out-of-existence-in-america-2010-7#83-percent-of-all-us-stocks-are-in-the-hands-of-1-percent-of-the-people-1
Your commenter makes the same false assertion of some law preventing foreign ships from helping in the BP clean up process. First, the Jones Act only applies to ships operating with in 3 miles of the shore, the collapsed well is further out than that. Also, their is an exemption for oil spills.
The history of mankind does not bode well for an anarchical/voluntarist system of government. It seems that when mankind left hunter gathering and settled into farming where the possession of land and related assets became associated with title and wealth accumaltion, was the same time that groups of armed men raided and pillaged these communities. The inevitable outcome was that these armed raiders instead of wiping out these communities decided to stay and “tax” these communities for protection against other rival armed gangs. Have we really progressed far from this state of affairs?
Its difficult to see how mankind can escape from this as long as these rival gangs ( now days nation states) are in existence and in perpetual competition. Its not difficult to see how the imperitive for bigger government has arisen. How to break this back into an anarchic/voluntarist system, as welcome as this would be seems to be beyond our current capacity to evolve.
@Stacy & Co.:
Hi from Germany,
why is it that you consider todays wars and worries to be caused by a manipulative and more-or-less secretive Elite, but ancient wars have in your mind been something like grass-root-genocide? It has always been the struggle towards the monopolization of power by a few interconnected people that has incited the masses to war and mass murder. Lord, Kings, Chancellors, TB2F-Fat-Cat-Bankers…
The “majority” has no “instinctive” interest in waging wars.
Anarchy in the Austro-Libertarian meaning (Anarchocapitalism) might be a distant utopia, but it is far more what I envision to be some kind of historical goal of mankind than a fatalistic surrendering to the absurd idea that “man in itself” is somehow inherently “evil”.
We as human beings have gone a long long way so far. We have reached as fair amount of Individual Liberties so far, but are also submitted to an unmachted level of surveillance and material control.
No one went further than “We the people” in 1776.
I wish Libertarians were at least not such a dramatic minority.
Statism is such a boring view of human society and interindividual communication.
Cheerio
Fabio (german libertarian, endangered species at least since 1871)
PS:
I really don`t give a damn about PC, I`m no leftie and I`m not a supporter of the Israel-Lobby, but as a matter of “humanitarian taste”, I wouldn`t exagerate with the diminitive use of the term “Holocaust”.
@gordo-”These problems are all due to corporations and the GOP”
Cheers my Man!!
The Rise of the Machines. Be prepared for your extermination. – Ford Otosan implements remote laser technology only seen in science-fiction films such as “Minority Report.” http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/n.php?n=ford-otosan-implements-remote-laser-technology-2010-07-15
Nothing like a bit of libertarian twaddle to finish the day.
You folk who deride Stefan Molyneux ,.obviously haven’t thought much about social sciences, and the practicality of working models. You seem intent on chastising the messenger, rather than the message.
How anyone is able to make a judgment, based on a 20 min’ clip is beyond me!
There are societal systems that could work, but have never been utilized, or, have ever been introduced into public consciousness.
So to blatantly rant on about Utopian dreams is akin to those idiots in ole Plato’s cave!
Anyway,..enough already,..BTW: don’t respond to this comment, I can’t be arsed to debate with parrots,…..: )
Goldman Criminals to pay $550 mln to settle SEC CDO suit http://www.marketwatch.com/story/goldman-to-pay-550-mln-to-settle-sec-cdo-suit-2010-07-15
GOLDMAN WINS AGAIN! Settles With SEC For Chump-Change $550 Million http://www.businessinsider.com/breaking-sec-is-going-to-make-a-significant-announcement-at-445-pm-2010-7
Huzzah…
A Nuck on the Report…
problems:
1) Canadian Gov’t does not print CURRENCY…
it prints SECURITIES
which can be issued to the BoC for Currency,
which is printed in GERMANY…
My Birth Certificate is Securitized
(See the Canadian Consolidated Revenue Fund for more info)
2) There is no need to keep people from investing in Markets…
the coming deflation will take care of that for them…
and if you follow economic data at all,
you’ll know exactly what I am talking about
The numbers that have come out globally, during the last month,
are SCREAMING a deflationary scenario…
hence, markets will drop…
Time for the NWO to Sack the Dollar before Europe grows realy out of its depression.
Goldman Reverses Euro Call, Sees Gains on Weak U.S. http://noir.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=aZwymSCCiAv8
Germany may have deficit in 2012 reduced
Germany, its government deficit already in 2012 have reduced to the European limit of 3 percent of gross domestic product (GDP). That is one year earlier than planned, according data from the Ministry of Finance.
Macroeconomic
The new projections are based on various macro-economic figures that were recently revealed. Pointing to a strong attraction of the German economy in the second quarter.
Largest economy
Germany, Europe’s largest economy, saw its economy shrink last year’s solid. Thus ran the government debt to well over 3 percent of GDP.
Economists
The German budget deficit is expected by the economists of the ministry this year amount to 4.5 percent. Next year it will come down to 4 percent and probably will be one years later, the 3 percent to be achieved.
BTW
Here’s a link to the Mystery of the Golden Train
program shown in the commercial break
http://rt.com/About_Us/Programmes/XL_Reports/2010-07-18/584212.html
It seems very strange that people have this idea that if those people called “the government” were to stop calling themselves “the government” that somehow humankind would get send back in time to 1200 (or whatever) to emerge, stripped bare of 800 years of accumulated knowledge, in some kind a ‘dark age’.
It’s 2010! It’ll be 2011 next year with “government” or not!
If we free people of the world stopped giving our consent to those people calling themselves “the government”…
- Hospitals would not disappear, nor doctors, nor nurses, nor sick people nor the willingness to help them for payment (direct from then on)
- The Internet is not going to vapourize, nor computers, nor iPhones, nor nuclear power plants, nor the electricity grids – your monthly utility bills will still be delivered!
- The policemen will still know how to save cats from tall trees, the firemen will know how to play poker whilst waiting for fires, the teachers will still want to teach (the good ones, anyway), the chuckleheads will still want to yap-yap on TV
Without “government” all that’s going to happen is you pay directly for the things you want, and in a transition to full freedom (I wish), you help to seek out problems where people might fall through the cracks.
It seems that the people most scared about “government” are the same people who least understand what a “government” really is.
‘What does the word “anarchy” really mean? It simply means a way of interacting with others without threatening them with violence if they do not obey. It simply means “without political violence.” When we think of a society without political violence – without governments – specters of chaos and brutality always arise for us, immediately and, it would seem, irrevocably. However, it only takes a moment of thought to realize that we live the vast majority of our actual lives in complete and total anarchy – and call such anarchy “morally good.” Love, marriage, family, career, finances – we all make our major decisions in the complete absence of direct political coercion. Thus – if anarchy is such an all-consuming, universal evil, why is it the default – and virtuous – freedom that we demand in order to achieve just liberty in our daily lives? We must recognize the basic paradox: We love the anarchy we live. We fear the anarchy we imagine – the anarchy we are taught to fear.’
http://www.freedomainradio.com/FreeBooks/EverydayAnarchy.aspx
YOU are already anarchists! The only time you’re not is when you’re agreeing to pay taxes and fines – and since “government” has automated most of that – you’re already FULL-TIME anarchists, like it or not. Did you pistol whip anyone today to avoid paying? Did you threaten anyone with imprisonment in your dungeon today if they didn’t put your purchase on a tab? No?? I’m shocked! I thought you WEREN’T anarchists!
Why are YOU so worried about the violence of others? All the violence comes from idiots trying to either get control of the guns of government or bamboozle the community with superstitious scare stories so they’ll agree to some theocratic goverment to protect them from the wrath of some imaginary god.
How do you think all this “government” nonsense got started in first place?
(Some good discussion of the origins of government amongst this series)
Freedomain Radio: The Death of the West
1/3 Prehistory to World War One
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASODMKCJcsk
2/3 The Nineteenth Century
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6_R4ZOzr-f4
3/3 The Twentieth Century
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RDudKTuYvOw
LOOK at the reality of the world you live in and how you already operate within it. You are each peaceful, sovereign individuals with nothing to fear from each other. You talk about valuing and defending your freedom, but then someone suggests withdrawing sanction from those thugs calling themselves “the government” and you’re suddenly willing to throw all that freedom away in some MadMax style FANTASY.
You nutters!
From the 50 ugliest, couple of my favs –
#14) Phoenix, Arizona features an astounding annual car theft rate of 57,000 vehicles and has become the new “Car Theft Capital of the World”.
#13) U.S. law enforcement authorities claim that there are now over 1 million members of criminal gangs inside the country. These 1 million gang members are responsible for up to 80% of the crimes committed in the United States each year.
So why do have bases all over the world? Why are we spending a trillion dollars on wars? Why is our defense budget $800b?
Oh yeah, the terrorism thing.
HOW ABOUT THE POLITICIANS AND DC ARE THE TERRORISTS.
THEY ARE CREATING THE TERROR RIGHT IN FRONT OF OUR OWN EYES.
The Federal Government creates terror for other people in other countries, why do we feel them to be benevolent to Americans? “Oh right, a murderer does that to other people, but he wouldn’t do that to me”
We are sick! We are sick if we continue to allow the Federal Government to grow like a cancer!
http://blogs.ubc.ca/dean/files/2009/02/thoreau1.jpg
Municipalities on the brink, but muni bonds hang in there http://www.marketwatch.com/story/government-budgets-weigh-on-economy-not-bonds-2010-07-15?pagenumber=1
“What’s making things worse is that we’re closer and closer to the point when public employee retirement plans are going to bankrupt states and localities unless there are big changes.” — Joshua Shapiro, chief U.S. economist at MFR Inc.
Dutch Exports back to pre crisis levels (google trans from Dutch) http://tinyurl.com/23hyhbf
@Adam C
Does your definition of Anarchy agree with Common Law (i.e. No harm unto others, No property damage, No fraud)?
If so, who would preside in dispute?
Great show!
Stefan Molyneux was a great guest pick and I’m sure we’ll be seeing more of him in the future.
For those not familiar with voluntarism, Stefan has some free ebook/audiobooks on the subjects:
Everyday Anarchy :
http://freedomainradio.com/LinkClick.aspx?link=78&tabid=59
Practical Anarchy :
http://freedomainradio.com/LinkClick.aspx?link=79&tabid=59
China want gold they are trying to buy all the gold they can , why dont they just buy up all the physical they can .
buy all gold or silver bullion for sale on ebay and from every mint in the world , send it back to china and stop buying us debt .
can any big brains on here tell me why this wouldnt be a good idea
Giuseppe Bago,….Instead of quizzing Adam C,..why don’t you try and use your own noodles,……and the same to the rest of ya !
Anyone fancy and “instant” coffee ? : )
@Dedo
I’m interested in debate in the search for truth…
And questioning Authority…
How are your Hot Dog sales these days?
Livin phat on the hog, are ye’ ?
And on the question of noodles,
how about you use yours and participate with something more useful beyond trite diminution of my or others’ character and intelligence?
Are you that flaccid or just upset that I haven’t perused your HOLY Book of Galambos?
wow best episode for ages stefan molyneux is awesome
@ Gordo – Did you catch the Democracy Now! segment about the right-wingers using Arizona as a model state to experiment with extreme-right wing laws? If not, you should check it out. (I had no idea that the yahoos passed a “constitutional right to hunt” law there.)
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_lBp7YCucdVE/SylH39xcUdI/AAAAAAAAB_o/nbF5sw9jh20/s400/menobook1.jpg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LU8DDYz68kM
It is so freaking simple for the US. It is not perfect but is an excellent stop-gap or an excellent imperfect long-range plan:
Just invert the whole damn model: More than any other country in the world, the US could do this – (a) give more rights to people, (b) reduce the federal power and allow the states to administer power, (c) reduce state power and give it the cities…
It is simple math – just maximize individual freedom and responsibility, while allowing the states and cities to compete, unencumbered by a Federal Father Figure.
Once most people are individually strong, then we can have a discussion about how we care about one another.
But this will never happen because people (the % grows daily) that desire to abdicate authority and individual autonomy, individual expression (responsibility, opportunity to know and care about their neighbor) and have a desire for some all-powerful entity to provide for them.
Wow, I think he said: “Now you see the violence inherent in the system!!”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o76WQzVJ434
call me a romantic.i have faith in my fellow man .what mr molyneux sees can be created ,on many levels hes right
Meno
by Plato?
Looks like a good read
http://www.gutenberg.org/files/1643/1643-h/1643-h.htm
@ Mep
Yes I caught that that, looks like the GOP is looking to ramp up the scapegoating and persecution.
@Baggo,…..”HOLY Book of Galambos” LOL,…..just one of many perspectives !
There are always better ways, but it seems folk seem to bounce from within a system that has been flawed since inception.
As you’re aware Baggo (and I keep iterating),.my intention to diminute yours and others intelligence and character, is to bring you out of your shells, she sells sea shells on the sea floor,…
Was that floor, or flaw,……hmmmm maybe shore,…or was it shaw,….
this was the ronron show. i posted every piece here i think. cool.
i always liked Stefan. hope they don’t taser the fucker.
sums it up. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fqFUmo8VVg0
@Dedo
If it is your attempt to bring others out of their shells,
then you fail…
It is perhaps due to your inability to delineate the direction of discovery for them…
Try harder, my son…
I am sure you can find a finer brush to use in your paintings…
and good luck with those hot dogs, eh….
@Baggo,….”then you fail”…
Again, Baggy,…you only see things from your perspective,..I’ve been quite successful in my mission,…but I’m sure it’s hard to see an aerial view through a window on just the one level !
Good luck in your search for truth,…: )
@Giuseppe Bagodonutti
>> Does your definition of Anarchy agree with Common Law (i.e. No harm unto others, No property damage, No fraud)?
Hell, yes! And good question. Common Law is just basic ‘common sense’ morality. I’ve been learning about anarchist philosophy and common law at the same time and I haven’t noticed any conflicts between the two. If anything, they are the just expressions of each other. I’m really excited for when this stuff is common knowledge which I think it will be soon because of the ease of access and quality of explanation, especially Stefan Molyneux (Freedomain Radio) and Robert-Arthur:Menard (search that name on YouTube)
Disputes will be resolved using private courts/DROs.
Some useful links:
# Morality
Freedomain Radio — Universally Preferable Behaviour: A Rational Proof of Secular Ethics (PDF)
http://www.fdrurl.com/UPBPDF
# Sovereignty and Common Law (Morality)
Google Video — ThinkFree: The Magnificent Deception (Robert-Arthur:Menard)
http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=6729904244308031068#
Google Video — ThinkFree: Bursting Bubbles of Government Deception (Robert-Arthur:Menard)
http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=-7040453665540929835#
# DROs
Freedomain Radio — Practical Anarchy (PDF)
http://www.freedomainradio.com/FreeBooks/PracticalAnarchy.aspx
The Stateless Society by Stefan Molyneux
‘The second problem is the fear that a particular DRO will grow in size and stature to the point where it takes on all the features and properties of a new State. This is a superstitious fear, because there is no historical example of a private company replacing a political State. While it is true that companies regularly use State coercion to enforce trading restrictions, high tariffs, cartels and other mercantilist tricks, surely this reinforces the danger of the State, not the inevitability of companies growing into States. All States destroy societies. No company has ever destroyed a society without the aid of the State. Thus the fear that a private company can somehow grow into a State is utterly unfounded. ..if society is so terrified of a single group seizing a monopoly of political power, what does that say about the existing States? They have a monopoly of political power. If a DRO should never achieve this kind of control, why should existing States continue to wield theirs?’
http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig6/molyneux1.html
Wikipedia — Dispute resolution organization
‘A dispute resolution organization, or DRO, is a conceptualized organization providing services such as mediation and arbitration through the private sector. A perceived advantage of dispute resolution organizations over governmental court systems is that the former can exist in a competitive marketplace in which entrepreneurs on the lookout for profits seek to outdo their rivals in providing good service, low prices, and other features valued by their clientele. #Enforceability of verdicts: Murray Rothbard opines that court decisions need not be enforced by the government in order to be effective. Even before the decisions of dispute resolution organizations were considered legally enforceable in government courts, merchants obeyed them to avoid the risk of ostracism and boycotts. A merchant who refused to abide by the verdict would be blacklisted and thus become unable to avail himself of an arbitrator’s services in the future.’
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dispute_resolution_organization
# Private Courts
The Daily Bell — Judge Andrew Napolitano on Chaotic Courts and ‘Unconstitutional’ Justice in the United States
DB: ‘In free-market common law, the aggrieved party and putative offender might both pay a judge to render a verdict. The judge, who did this for a living, would have every incentive to present a fair verdict because such verdicts would add luster to his or her reputation and generate additional business. Additionally, common law has the added advantage that not everyone would take advantage of it, and that some would seek to settle grievances on their own. This would result in a very polite society (and has in the past) as no one would want to offend anyone else. Once upon a time, “manners” were far more elaborate and prevalent for a reason. There is also an issue of honor and morality. In communal societies, where power has devolved to local levels, religion [?] can often play an important role in how society is organized and how law is administered. Such societies are often shame-based, or have been in the past, and the prospect of shaming may act as a behavior modifier…’
http://www.thedailybell.com/1108/Judge-Andrew-Napolitano-on-Chaotic-Courts-and-Unconstitutional-Justice-in-the-United-States.html
The Daily Bell — Horror of Common Law?
‘The sensible focus of common law involves private, marketplace justice and allows aggrieved parties to solve both civil and criminal offenses on their own using the standards of community morality. This sort of justice is not based on precedent but on common sense and tends to limit quarrels and even violence. Precedent justice, combined with the West’s modern-day prison-industrial complex, will inevitably give rise to a web of complex criminal and civil “laws” that will continually expand over time. Unlike common law, the precedent-based legal system can only multiply its “laws” until almost everything can be considered a prosecutable action. The end result is an oppressive and impossibly complex system good for intimidation and control. — As the current monetary system continues its unrolling collapse, we expect the worst excesses of the current statist judiciary to begin to retreat as well.’
(Also check the comments)
http://www.thedailybell.com/1180/Horror-of-Common-Law.html
In lieu of Dedo’s attempt to derail my train of thought
@Adam C
Does your definition of Anarchy agree with Common Law (i.e. No harm unto others, No property damage, No fraud)?
If so, who would preside in dispute?
Nevermind Adam C
It seems we posted at the same time
Forgive my aberrant FAT FINGER
And thanx for the reply
Hi Max and Stacy
Thanks for talking about Canada.
TCU
http://www.greaterfool.ca/ Canadian’s realestate porn is the theme. Garth got kicked out of Harpers government for his blog
I’m sure this has been linked to a multiple times in here already.
Goldman avoided the fraud allegations it feared the most and scored a major victory in its legal battle. http://www.cnbc.com/id/38268903
Settlement – determination of dispute by mutual agreement without resorting to legal proceedings . . . does that also work when confronted with allegations of murder or theft? Perhaps violence or bank robbery? How about allegations of counterfeiting or rape?
If you just pay for your sin – it will go away.
It worked with religion some centuries ago and it works just as well with finance today.
Something always gives me a chill when I hear someone talking about “humane” solutions.
Forgot this one.
TheAntiTerrorist: The Prison Without Bars
http://www.twoplustwoequalsfour.org/post/797263401/theantiterrorist-the-prison-without-bars
http://www.theantiterrorist.co.uk
@Adam C
Menard…
one man I’d love to smoke a doob with…
http://www.youtube.com/user/mrmitee
Anyone in BC should watch his vids…
The BP Hoax – It’s an illusion! 15 July 2010, (BP Hoax) http://bphoax.com/the-event/its-an-illusion/
BREAKING NEWS! IT’S A LIE! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvjTBT67GAE
@ ADAM C
As regards no historical examples of a corporation taking the place of a nation state I believe that there is such an example–
The Hanseatic League (Hansa) was formed around the middle of the 12th century by German and Scandinavian seafaring merchants. Since there were no navies to protect their cargoes, no international bodies to regulate tariffs and trade, and few ports had regulatory authorities to manage their use, the merchants banded together to establish tariff agreements, provide for common defense and to make sure ports were safely maintained.
The original network linked Lübeck, Westfalia, Saxony and Gotland, but it quickly spread east with the conquest of Livonia in the early 13th century. The league became so profitable and so powerful that it lasted over three centuries. At its peak, the Hanseatic League covered the entire North Sea and Baltic Sea Regions and it stretched hundreds of miles inland along rivers from the Rhine to the Daugava.
Though Hansa relations were primarily economic in nature, the League became a formidable political and military power in the 14th Century. The Baltic Region that is known today as Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania became a viable economic unit in the world market and participant in European politics via the relationships fostered by the Hansa
mr bagodonuttis (beignets) …not to profit from the sufferin of others,,,,, if your not going to eat it,, you dont kill it ..i dont think its that complicated ,,
sorry for adding the extra letter,,i like meno its like at the beggining to set a basic tenant for the republic
i think the other part was my pa pa ,,not plato
@GGees
In the way that you’ve described it, that’s not a government. It’s just a group of private interests working together to pool resources.
It’s a bit like saying Wal-Mart is a government because of its of massive size as an entity. But Wal-Mart is not a government because everybody involved in the business are there voluntarily for mutual advantage as defined in contracts.
The essential difference between “government” and freedom is whether resources are provided for via coercion where property rights are violated.
Providing for defense doesn’t make it a government. The DRO model for a free, anarchist ‘society’ proposes defense of communities funded by insurance. (I’m really not sure why people think there’s no commitment to law and order in anarchism. Pro-Statist propaganda, most likely.)
The above is what I understand from your description. I could be wrong. Happy to discuss further.
Thanks.
>> Though Hansa relations were primarily economic in nature, the League became a formidable political and military power in the 14th Century.
This bit, I missed it on my first reading.
So it started as a group of private interests that became a ‘political’ “government”?? It became a gang of thugs that taxed a populace against their will??
The great thing about being here in 2010 rather than the 12th century is we have learned all the lessons of history AND we have lived through, and gained the fruits of, technological progress.
We DO have to look back at history for empirical evidence of human relations and social/poltiical practices, but those people back then… they are not us. The solutions we have now weren’t available to them.
For Losers who have all their money hold up in Solid Gold – This is Free
Oklahoma Bureau of Narcotics Warning Parents About I-Dosing http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PZcgUEkBIX0
@ Giuseppe Bagodonutti
;^)
Yeah, that dude taught me the true meaning of being honour and being honourable. When you get that — FEEL that — you totally get how anarchism/voluntaryism will work.
Roling Cloud (Holland) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qyWSKgpfF7U
This is too good not to post! With the crap thats being said about the economy and the eminent disasters that could possibly confront us all, I thought why not go down memory lane and check out the “yes we can” cult from todays perspective…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqALdkTArqs
@MirrorMirror, thanks for the link, very good one and very possible for sure.
Beyond Prophecy 2010 12 Recent Discoveries Which Change EVERYTHING! http://beyondprophecy.blogspot.com/p/2010-12-things-that-changed-everything.html
@Jim
Thirst I thought it was utter crap but after some studiyng the subject – listening to backwards playing somgs an speeches and all I am not so sure.
There was a boy who could talk backwards naturaly so the mind works in ways we now even just begin to understand. The Mind can digest information in diffirent ways also subconsiously.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DYBQdXv0BhM
@Youri Carma, I think you missed the point! Meant as a joke!
Heres some drivel for ya
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c5y_gE1Rb1Y&feature=related
Darn it! Why can’t I agree with everything Max and Stacy say? Life would be so much simpler then… but, alas, I do not agree with everything they, or their guests, say.
For instance, I find it highly ironic that Max and Stacy put themselves up to be the watchdog of the Internet when they themselves are giving the emails they capture (YOUR EMAILS) to a third party. As soon as I signed up to record my comments, as I am doing now, I began to receive emails from zerohedge.com. Which leads me to wonder… HOW MUCH IS MY EMAIL WORTH, MAX… HOW MUCH? Ever heard of opt-in email marketing??
Secondly, Stefan mentions that the Taiwanese super skimmer boat was denied access to US waters. This is false as it is being tested in the Gulf: http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE65O5TA20100704?type=domesticNews&feedType=RSS&feedName=domesticNews
Sigh.
great show, thanks guys..
Paul McCartney on the Upright Elvis Black Bass http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3uzC5KC_260
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wJZeYJTlsUQ&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lOXnSdXV-0I
Stefan. Either VOTE or buy your own island and make your own rules.
Good info on Canada. I didn’t realize.
excellent interview.
Good interview
The volunteerisim is tricky because the history of mankind is a pretty dark one. Look at France, it was in the presidential election some 8 years ago that 9 million or was it 6 million french voted for the extreme right.
Look at UK. Proportional representation is at the heart of Lib Dems election reforms, but not any more. They going now for Alternative Vote system. Why? Obviously the powers that be explained to them that in no way will a system be allowed that lets the BNP win seats. AV consolidates the position of the 3 main parties at the expense of all other smaller parties including the Greens.
We constantly hide from the evil within us all and externalise it in some “other”. The rituals that marry life and society that exist in many indiginous peoples are wiped out in the west. Atomisation fuels the paranoia.
@max and stacy
The Keiser Report has been on RT at 10pm each evening this week. Much better watching you on TV than youtube. Keep up the brilliant work
Talk about a moment of Zen! Seeing Max Keiser and Stefan Molyneux together leaves me speechless (in an extremely good way!).
My respect for Max has tripled in value. Bravo, Sir!
Now, if you get Marc Stevens from the No State Project on…Whew!
Peace to Max & Stacy!
Holip
Great interview Max.. Had to say as a voluntaryist myself, my estimation of you and stacy has doubled my admiration for you both and what you are doing.. Keep it up sir!..
Democracy! Where? Did we vote to allow Government to sell Govt. bonds and throw us in to future debt? Do the general public even know that this is going on? Taxes can only go up if we have already spent the money!!!!!
Just brilliant.
The shows are still getting better an better.
I thought you might have run out of interesting topics and guests by now, but boy was I wrong
Great insights. Email to friends time.
Thanks.
Best guest on the show yet.
@Fiatmentalist
>> We constantly hide from the evil within us all and externalise it in some “other”.
So true. A quote.
“Once you get that self-bullying doesn’t work, you know that violence doesn’t work, you know that to your very core.” — Stefan Molyneux
Coca Cola committed holocaust…? Against teeth?
Canada is a snow ball still in flight – it has yet to reach the wall, it will! The padding and saving grace is the percentage of people who work directly for a government agency or a company that services a public sector agency. This is almost 60 % or probably more of working Canadians. The private sector is a minimum wage mecca. Tick Tock -
I WOULD REALLY LIKE TO GET OFF THIS TRAIN!
@kwazimota – re battle at kruger
yeah, there we are a bunch of buffalo. there are like 1000 buffalo…and it takes them about an hour to get the courage to attack. and they never attacked. it was like ONE brave buffalo (or a couple). the rest standing around. disgusting. we can learn a lot from (dumb) animals. now, what are we going to do about those hyenas in Washington?
Message to Max and Stacey – if you wish to consider discussing sustainable solutions for the planet, please consider getting Peter Joseph of the Zeitgeist Movement onto your show. He has excellent knowledge on the banking system and the monetary system as a whole, and the movement itself offers excellent, scientifically supported ideas and solutions.
@Bronxy
. . . Against the population suffering from depleted groundwater and polluted rivers do to coca cola production and waste.
Max and Stacey, like many previous posts have said, BRAVO!! Mr. Molyneux is a self-professed anarachist, but yet you gave him an opportunity to present his view with no interruptions, and I’m grateful to the both of you. Been a big fan of Stefan for years. He believes, as I, that each of us are not only capable, but given the incentive to do so, can solve these problems in a much more peaceful manner.
I’m reminded of the sign that sits on Dr. Ron Paul’s desk at his Congressional Office. “Don’t Steal, The Government Hates Compeitition”. Peace is the biggest compeitor that the Government faces. Let’s hope it wins the battle of ideas. Keep up the great work Max and Stacey!!
philosophical gibber jab, the bullshit so thick it pouring from your eyes. Stop thinking, we don’t need any of this nonsense. Productive what hell the is productive about doing things you don’t want to do. Are these your damn dreams, are you stupid.conform to my way, no mine, no mine, no wait this is better, think , think.
Stop it, close the book, stop being impressed by the squiggly lines, there’s no meaning to them, everyone’s been trying to figure them out, even made up different languages and characters to decipher it. Got us to thinking. Well maybe there’s an easy way. so you spend all the time in the squiggly lines making up new squiggly lines, and some one has to bring you food, and the guy bringing you food is sick of that, he wants to read some squiggly lines, so someone can bring him food and then there are so many squiggly line readers that you have to grow food. All the while if you close the book the words go away and the food is right outside on a bush or a tree, or as a leaf. And you don’t need a plateful, you just need a few morsels at a time and water it comes from a stream or a spring, and you don’t need any thinking about where and how. And you can stop trying to find the question to the why or how of the answers you’ve been given, because you never had a damn question in the first place.
A kinder gentler, smoother fancier decorated slavery is still slavery.
http://wp.me/p30mf-Ve
sorry, I couldn’t resist
C’mon Canada invite me!
What we want and what will work?
Let’s be clear, men are not angels. Fear of hell used to work, science has since altered that. Church scandals haven’t helped.
Merit, not sure that will work since everyone is a bit saturated with awards and recognition for everything, even last place.
National pride – books and information has changed that – the country is still divided along those line.
Competition – not as attractive any more. People want more quality and quantity time with their families.
Money – $60k seems to be the leveling out place for most people and happiness. When you add the millions bankers receive for making nothing in society we get what we have now. Clearly not working.
Under these current conditions perhaps character and honesty will make a comeback.
Is it time to stop being hunters and become farmers again?
I think what people want or yearn for most of all in our society is dedication with purpose and to enjoy the work they do..
Least for now.
It clearly states right on the American buckaroo “In god we trust” my question is, were does that leave us atheists?
I still go to church I’m not a Fn’ heathen!
Good show as always. Really enjoyed that bit of the FBI/Dea agents getting”ponzeed”–ha ha too funny. I have this feeling Paraguay is seeing an exploding (Millionaire/billionaire) immigration population, –know what I mean. Glad to hear you on The Corbett Report the other day too.
–Van
Incentive. The incentive cannot be money. Because money doesn’t make happy. The feedback, or the payback, for good work, is contentment. Content-ment. A feeling. Connection. Peace. Money is only a helping tool. Don’t you see? Maybe investigate more the topic of primary and secondary motivation. Money is a typical, THE typical secondary motivation. You don’t ever do anything solely for money, unless u r a complete Zombie, but even then, u r after something “beyond” that.
US shifts ICBM-loaded sub fleet from Atlantic to Pacific. Message to China: “Buy US debt…OR ELSE!”
Hmmm. North Korea sounds like a good place to start destabilizing a huge swath of Asia.
Clearly one of the most articulate guests I’ve ever heard. Bravo!
Nice.
@ Max
Can we have Steve Keen next ?
Cheers
From a stupid United States American:
Isn’t one of the big problems with capitalism, not the system itself, but the “pensioner” system. Too many pensioners living not only off of their pensions, but also taking undue advantage of social programs? How many wealthy people accept their social security payments yet have plenty of money to do without it? Also folks are frightened of loosing their life’s savings and make portfolio investments in companies (or countries) that are destroying the environment. Not only are people afraid of loosing their savings, they are afraid of other countries and endorse military and law enforcement expenditures that are bankrupting the United States.
The wealthy and barely wealthy can take their dollars off shore, depriving the system of needed taxes.
Thanks Max and Stacy for covering the so-called economic prosperity in Canada. I knew it was a scam like everything else by the Banksters. Canada is in debt up to it’s highballs and yet people dont get it.
Oh well, perhaps the G20 Gestpo tactics will wake up some more people from their sleep and this prison which has been carefully placed around us.
@dedo,
The models of social “scientists” are fairy tales that studiously ignore reality, and when one attempts to force reality to fit the “models,” they quickly are proven to be nightmares (a la attempts to implement Marx’s vision, and most recently, attempts to implement Milton Friedman’s neoliberal vision).
Just look at political economy (now just “economics” so as to hide that the “science” is merely a branch of politics). Anybody with a hard science background can see fairly quickly what a load of crap neoclassical economics is, yet its fallacious “models” guide the policies of governments, business and individuals. Meanwhile, the profound observations of insitutional economists like Gunar Myrdal and John Kenneth Galbraith are ignored because they didn’t use models.
Social scientists are not real scientists, and they should stop pretending that they are, stop pretending that they have something profound to say about the way the world ought to be because their pretend “models” of fairy tale fantasies work (but only if you ignore reality). Ditch the model envy already. The proper role of the social scientist is that of a secular priest: to help us understand how the world IS and how it CAN BE, if certain conditions are met (but be explicit about the conditions, don’t pretend the boundary conditions don’t exist).
Whatever Molyneux is, he’s also a dupe of an ideology that was tailor made to take smart, naive, ideological people and turn them against their own best interests and prevent the development of any kind of common sense. The founders of the modern libertarian movement have proven time and again that their vision of utopia is completely bankrupt. We have both Mises and Friedman pretending like the individual, the entrepeneur, is the primary economic actor when, in fact, the corporation, a fictitious, amoral person protected by limited liability by the state, was the primary economic actor at the time. We have Friedman and the Chicago Boys pointing to a dictatorship in Chile as a proof of their free market ideology. We have Latvia’s debt peonage as the direct result of Friedman’s neoliberal policies. The list goes on. At every turn, these guys drive the common man to denounce governments while they embrace governments to do remake the world into a modern worldwide corporate feudalist state.
When the high priests of your religion preach abstinence but molest the proverbial altar boy, I don’t care what your “models” say, there is no there there.
Leave it to the Canadian assholes federalists from Ottawa to ruin the country for good. What’s funny about the Canadian story is the Conservatives which are TOTAL MADE IN USA ASSHOLES used to blame the Liberals of being TOTAL ASSHOLES. Canadians are TOTAL USA assholes. That’s the sad truth. Canada desserves to implofde it’s so stupid and moronic. We should of left that country 15 years ago. We almost did. Canadian USA federalist assholes. Yeah it’s a nosebleed bubble and the same bastard in Ottawa will make us eat shit as usual. Personnally I really hope seing Canada dissapear. Cultureless USA shithole. It’s a cultural commentary and a financial too. All the facts cited are true. Canada is busted. Kaput.
Canadian monkey see American monkey do. Canadian monkey from Ottawa do EXACTLY the same or even worse. Have you seen the Ontario debt and deficit lately ? Québec is not bad even compared with Ontario. We will all be in deep shit and yes statism is bankrupt system.
Must specify ONE thing here. You will notice that our TOTAL SCUM in Ottawa likes mostly socialism when it’s about helping the banksters. Privatize the profits and socialize ALL the losses. Good work Brownie Harper. It’s statism of a special kind. It’s called national socialism.
CANADA = Nothing. Do not forget that the Bank of Canada boss Mister Carney worked (and still workd for the Godfather) in the past for the GOLDMAN SACHS GANGSTERS. Says it all. Canada does not exist. It’s a funniy country. A non country like Ukraine under USSR. A peaceful and boring USA banana republic. THAT’S IT. An yeaj I forgot the assholes still have on their dollar bill the Queen of England. Stupid colonial peasants.
Yeah I have a right to be mad.I still pay my taxes in this stupid country called Canada. The party is over. We have indeed very dumb people running this country. The dumbness as hidden by pure luck. The luck is running out. It is a lot in sum like the really stupid Australians. Quite similar.
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/canadas-greece-ontario-better-get-its-act-together/article1494452/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+TheGlobeAndMail-HYOntario+%28The+Globe+and+Mail+-+Ontario+News%29
Canada has a Greece. A big fat Ontario-Greece wedding. Not just Quebec.
Stefan Molyneux
Amazing,,Great speaker,,,fluid, articulate, compelling, clear, panache…..Have this man on again..
Good work Max, Stacy the zeitgeist is changing, evolving.
Death “kneel”, Max??
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/knell
Yes, people in Canada have gotten greedy. I live in northern Canada, in Yellowknife, the Diamond capital of north america. Everyone here needs a car, truck, boat, camper and a big house, otherwise they think they are ‘missing out’ on life. It’s sad really, I have a used car, used truck, a tent, a canoe and a half a duplex. I have a great life, and I’m not eyeballs deep in credit cards either. Too bad too many others took on such massive loans, and buy food with their credit cards. Thanks for your Canadian content on your show, I’ve been watching for over a year now. Too bad Yellowknife is all mined out of gold, although I’m sure there is still some around. Keep up the great work!
I was a Realtor from 1999 to about 2005 and when I took my realtor classes in 1999 we were taught that when the interest rates on short term/over-night bank rates went down, the long term bond rates/30 year T-bills would go up and thus the mortgage rates which were long term rates as well – and vice versa. As Max says, it was the inverse. But I never saw this actually happen, during the Clinton years both long and short term and mortgage rates all seemed to go down down down and follow each other doing so, and on into the Bush years as well. Why is that? Was it market manipulation by Greenspan and the Fed?
@Sam
Canadians are quite good at bullshitting. I know. The problem is that most Canadians believe in their own bullshit. They think that they are different. It’s quite similar to what I saw in Europe. Most Europeans two years ago thaught that Europe had no subprimes and no stupid banksters. Same thing in Canada.