Ladies and gentlemen, I introduce you to Christopher Walter Monckton, 3rd Viscount Monckton of Brenchley. The right honourable demagogue of denial, the journalist most often referred to and linked to as the seeker of truth (click on link to find response from one of the few scientists that bothers to respond), defender of freedom from Al Gore:
Lord Christopher Monckton has long had pretensions to power as witnessed when he emailed a climate scientist stating:
“I am a member of the House of Lords, though without the right to sit or vote, and I have never suggested otherwise.”
To which the House of Lords Information Center advises:
Christopher Monckton is not and has never been a Member of the House of Lords. There is no such thing as a “non-voting” or “honorary” member.
Alas, as he was not and has never been a member of the House of Lords, the hereditary peer was free to proceed to seek power to protect the little people by running for a seat in the House of Commons as a candidate for UKIP. He promised his would-be constituents to free British schools from the tyranny of Al Gore by vowing to ban An Inconvenient Truth from all classrooms. The Lord went on to get ZERO votes. No, not one of his miserable, wretched and ungrateful would-be constituents dared to vote for the man who would defend them from Al Gore’s tyranny. Slaves, every one of them.
For, of tyranny, the good Lord knows a thing or two, as you can see here in this American Spectator article the good Lord penned himself in 1987:
“. . . there is only one way to stop AIDS. That is to screen the entire population regularly and to quarantine all carriers of the disease for life. Every member of the population should be blood-tested every month … all those found to be infected with the virus, even if only as carriers, should be isolated compulsorily, immediately, and permanently.”
Lord Monckton, in the article he wrote, envisioned that perhaps 3 million Americans would be quarantined for life under his plan and 30,000 of his own little Brits. I do wonder if he is for banning Al Gore’s work in order to defend us from tyranny, would he not have been for banning oh say Tony Kushner’s work to protect us from those who would dare humanize the victims of AIDS our good Lord Monckton had caged in the US and UK?
Today, Lord Monckton says:
“the article was written at the very outset of the AIDS epidemic, and with 33 million people around the world now infected, the possibility of [quarantine] is laughable. It couldn’t work.”
“Couldn’t work” . . . ha ha ha; ohmygod, that’s soooo laughably funny! Look, I just read m’lord’s quote to Max:
But, m’lord, if say Halliburton were to make it possible that 33 million people could be quarantined . . . would your plan be ‘workable?’
UPDATE: Lord Monckton was the sole ‘expert’ witness the Republicans called to testify at the May 6, 2010 Select Committee hearing on “The Foundation on Climate Science”; note that the Democrats had three scientists testify, not Al Gore and not David deRothschild. I wonder if the Republicans were unable to get any scientists willing to testify under oath what Lord Monckton was happy to do in order to influence US national policy? Perhaps they were unwilling to participate in another infamous moment ala:
  |
 |
![[Most Recent Quotes from www.kitco.com]](http://www.weblinks247.com/indexes/idx24_usd_en_2.gif)
![[Most Recent Quotes from www.kitco.com]](http://www.kitconet.com/charts/metals/silver/t24_ag_en_usoz_2.gif)
![[Most Recent Quotes from www.kitco.com]](http://www.kitconet.com/charts/metals/gold/t24_au_en_usoz_2.gif)
![[Most Recent Quotes from www.kitco.com]](http://www.kitconet.com/charts/metals/platinum/t24_pt_en_usoz_2.gif)
Monckton would be a great guest (if you two ever grow a pair…)
Good morning Stacy! I hope you had a nice breakfast.
Well, too bad about Lord Monckton. Still, the burden of proof is on the alarmists and they have not made the case that man (and woman) kind is to blame for global warming. Instead, they have rushed to judgment with shoddy science.
As I’ve said before, environmental destruction is funded and caused by the counterfeiting cartel. Climate change would be a non-issue if government backed usury did not exist.
*getting out popcorn*
here we go…
stacy, why are you doing this? we been over this. all the people that agree with your point of view have stated that repeatedly and there is no need to convince them anymore. the people on the other side will in no less than about 500 comments state the following:
#1 your tactic is clearly to attack the man’s credibility and you’re avoiding discussing his arguments that you dismiss as irrelevant exactly because his credibility is questionable.
#2 what about 20.000+ scientists who like peer review and the scientific process who have a say in this. they are not lords, they never said they were and there is irrefutable evidence that they have clear, unambigous arguments against the influence of our presence on this blue ball as relates to the blue ball’s climate.
#3 about the aids thing; in the early 80s the congressional record shows that the aids virus is classified as species threatening i.e. if it isn’t contained it has the ability to wipe out mankind. probably monckton and many other people who dealt with this subject were influenced by this notion when thinking about how to contain it. furthermore, the whole issue of aids is not a good thing to throw inhere because:
#3.1 it implies divide and conquer on this site: about half the readers will be convinced that the aids virus came from a monkey in africa and made its way around the world. the other half will go into stuff like ‘it’s been manufactured in fort dietrich as a race specific bio weapon to further the depopulation agenda, etc. etc.’
So not only have we already a divide and conquer scheme as far as AGW goes on this site, now you move it into the AIDS direction. I must believe you are aware of the controversies and unclarities around this very virus and that this will invite all sorts of further mind-fucking for a lack of a better term.
People come here because we don’t wanna end up in a casino gulag economy run by and for the bankers while we are deprived of all and any freedoms and rights we and our forefathers have ever fought for. Yet you, as a supposed protagonist of this fight against this agenda, do everything to split up the community.
Focus on what unites us! Anything else is bullshit.
Re the post… not sure this pompous iconoclast’s AIDs comments 23 years ago destroy his credibility as a purveyor of caution and skepticism on a separate issue, today. He’s probably said some more embarrassing things than that, and appeared weirder and more bug-eyed in some photos you didn’t found
… luckily it’s not yet a crime to be weird-looking and say outlandish things.
Herbert vs Monckton? Never gonna happen. *scoffing sound*
How Convienent
@ Stacy
Send me 500 $ a month I am a NWO Govt. Official
I will Solve the Climate Change
And really ya guys need to get off yer Butt’s and have a look at China & India
Just as ya guys got of yer Butts and moved to France to get a Worlds perspective of USA
You need to do the same to get an understandin of Carbon Credits
How are they Gonna implement it
Have you seen that Plan??????
Not the theory implimentation Plan ;->the practical implimentation plan
PS
I hope Max has’nt invested too much in the Carbon Credits thang
I pridict its gonna be a huge failure
@ Stacy
Princess Diana was also concidered an Out-Cast after the split
So accordin to yas Diana was’nt a Princess
So dont Blow tis Balooney
lololololol
ROFL
Hic
Working for Thatcher says enough..
It would be grand if he could be caught on some libel or defamation charge, after all he us toying around whith the pillars of British authority.
@Max
I find truth seekers come in many varieties (not all equaly impressive). I think you would stand out if you accentuated some truths are facts. Facts are physical obstructions, truths are elements of understanding.
Monckton is the source of the river denial.
as the river flows – it picks up more kooks and crazies who – for the life of me – since I can’t quite get a handle on their thinking – can only be described as coprophagists.
there is no upside to living in carbon pollution and suffering the consequences of MM global warming and climate change.
when I hear a denier I think of John Waters’ Divine character eating dog poo in this infamous clip from pink flamingos.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XbNUoBSovMw
why do people want to eat their own garbage and filth?
the strange voo-doo (poo poo) power of fox news I guess.
Mother
in a world of fiat currencies there are no truths, only profits and losses.
@ ME
It would be grand if he could be caught on some libel or defamation charge, after all he us toying around whith the pillars of British authority
@ ME
I thought we were all Equale ????
So sorry he sussed the NWO attempt to use BULSHIT to blag us into carbon taxes….so sorry he very skillfuly pissed all over the Global warming crew…so sorry he BLEW their mad CDO Carbon plan to bits
Tough shit we won, you lost Flat earth-er!
Mike
@Bonn – we’re only invested in gold, silver, other precious metals and cash; it’s a perfect hedge against the twin eco-eco disasters; and, I will state once again, for the 1000th time, I am not for stopping climate change; Max may have a different view on that, but I like nature programs and disaster films; and I have now spent close to 75 hours reading all the links people provided in the comments from my first posting and I have learned a whole lot more about an almost complete absence of any scientific research or modeling and, instead, an almost total reliance on assertion of opinion and also about the one man above and the two scientists (one of them a creationist, the other on the payroll of Exxon who has not had one peer-reviewed paper on his assertions regarding global warming) who most link to; other than these three people who are most frequently cited, there were only about four or five other scientists, not one of whom had a peer-reviewed research paper; the only thing in common amongst them (other than Philip Morris and the two Philip Morris financed ‘think tanks’) is that they are all 100% certain whereas most of the tens of thousands of climate scientists who believe in global warming put about a 90% chance of climate change happening; the 8 or 9 scientists who don’t believe in global warming are also the only scientists in any field that have 100% certainty about anything; I can think of no law of physics that is so certain as there is almost always some exception discovered somewhere down the line
@ Stacy
yas again missed me point
IMPLIMENTATION !!!
So if I buy 10,000 Carbon Credits I can get away with a Chernobyl or a Union Carbide Disastour ???
PS
Good ta hear yas only in Gold
ROFL
Hic
@Stacy — Aren’t you’re sick of overpowering the weak and the frail here in the comments. Kick it up a notch and debate Monckton. Otherwise you’re just being a power-troll.
Yours with a skeptical, cautious 51% sincerity.
& Also
Bear in Mind as I have stated before
90 % Scientest’s are on Govt. role and tey need Fundin
I have also told yas about me personal Expeience @ SERC Dept where I werked fer 14 months
The Computer Centre, established in 1970 as a central computing facility, became Supercomputer Education and Research Centre (SERC) in 1990 to provide …
http://www.serc.iisc.ernet.in/ – Cached – Similar
@ ME
tis is fer ya
SecurityOfThePersonSmall.mov
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=436798682226252164#
ThinkFree Presents : The Magnificent Deception
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=436798682226252164#docid=6729904244308031068
Think Free : Bursting Bubbles of Government Deception
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=436798682226252164#docid=-7040453665540929835
Kinda makes ya tink
* correction
90 % Climate Scientest’s are on Govt. role and tey need Fundin
@Stacy,..If you follow the money,..you’ll know that the best investments are “people”,…
Once that is established,…persuade them to exchange their labor for paper, with pretty pictures on it,…
In the old days,…we used to call it slavery LOL hahahhahahahahahahahaha
Oh its Sunday time fer Good oll http://tarpley.net/world-crisis-radio/
tas tee only place where I know whats really goin on an how close we are or are not to WW 3 many times I have noticed that what Tarpley talks about comes in me Newspaper 2 weeks later
lololololol
ROFL
Hic
I love you Stacy for the stuff you dig up. Please get him on one of your shows. He’s always saying how people are terrified of debating him.
I predict that the development of ultra quiet fans and cooling systems for the home, probably based on PC fan technology will score on the warming upside.
Unfortunately Dyson went for design and ego price tag over noise and probably scored a suicide ego logic bomb own goal. A combination of ultra low noise PC fan technology and the Dyson job (to step up the blow rate) less the crazy price tag will be the winning blow job.
Greenpeace Leader Admits Arctic Ice Exaggeration BBC
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NC7bE9jopXE
US Government in Massive New Global Warming Scandal – NOAA Disgraced
http://www.climatechangefraud.com/climate-reports/7479-us-government-in-massive-new-global-warming-scandal-noaa-disgraced
Didnt he star along side Max in Alex Jones latest movie? Nah? Bet he will in the next one. Told ya the paralysis of the public is caused by the media, mainstream and alternative.
@Max
So you talk about the profitability of gold and a sound economic system, I guess what makes it captivating is the cognitive dissonance so many need to maintain which has to break up some time..
@Stacy
It is the nature of measurements and predictive models that they have a limited certainty, but it is also the weakness of scientist that they apply their way of dealing with science on their way of dealing with the public. If the audience does not know what a standard deviation is, it makes no sense to mention the numbers. It only makes sense to translate it to concrete effects, the most effective of which are monetary: Your hous value will collapse if it is in a flooded area. Oil creates more flouds and hurricanes..
Monckton hypnot-eyes-es. It is that simple. His language is ful of open ends, entertainment, high scholl behaviour, references to authority some part of the public loves to serve and he keeps the avid deniers confused so they can’t go anywhere.
And what If I travel 100 Km in me Car I gotta buy 1 Carbon Credit
What If a Loo is another 15 Km away I pay 0.25 credit to use a loo ?????
lolololololol
ROFL
Hic
Monckton is right about Global Warming.
If the russians dont like their weather they should just plant more trees so their land doesnt become a desert
@Max
You are a closet Passolini adept
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TyrEA0I3pH8
John Abraham (Univ. of St Thomas professor who supposedly refutes Monckton), is taken apart point by point here :
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2010/07/14/condensed-monckton/
http://www.climatechangefraud.com/enviro-extremists/7340-abraham-surrenders-to-monckton-univ-of-st-thomas-endorses-untruths
I so dont understand why many cannot see that Cap and Trade carbon credits will just get hugely run up as a dervivative traded bubble by the banksters. I dont trust liars, and the pro-man caused global warming crew is so rife with scoundrels, and liars (Climategate, banksters, almost all the big petrol companies, the UN, CFR, Club of Rome autocrats, etc).
The interesting thing is, we got to these industrial and pollution levels not from CO2, nor from population growth, but from cheap, easy paper money and credit! No one wants to talk about that! Not Gore, the government & corporate teet fed Scientists nor anyone for that matter.
I mean, one of the “spokesmen” for the Green people is David Rothschild, how ironic and hypocritical is that?!?!
Stacey and Max, if you’re itching for a good debate then the next time Max goes on Alex Jones, open up this can of worms! AJ loves a good debate and he knows a lot about this subject.
The people off the sponzi scheme don’t want critics
The people of the global warning don’t want critics.
So blame it on your self that the bankers don’t lissen, because yourselve are the same, when you loke on your opinion about global warning.
excuse for my bad englisch.
Greetings from Holland. StilI I am a big fan of Max Keiser site.
Anyway I cant wait to see yer faces when Free Energy technolohys are released
Hic
6000 years or 4 billion years what evr yer fetish lol
Things Invented
0) Fire. ( state Fire cause ya can burn stuff copper etc etc……)
1) A wheel.
2) a boat.
3) Gun poweder.
Come 19th century A Gazillion inventions
So fer 6000 / 4 billion years 4 inventions and ten infinity ??????WTF ?????
WE are the monkeys … as Deek explains …
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G5t3j6xQLmY
He’s damn good … serious guy as well.
“most of the tens of thousands of climate scientists who believe in global warming put about a 90% chance of climate change happening”
Theres tens of thousands of climate change scientists?
None of them base any conclusions on what they “believe”. Science is a discipline!!
Climate change is a PERMANENCE if it wasnt there would be no need for climate science, the question is how much of a factor man is having.
hell, even the huckster Rupert Murdoch and Fox, in the end, push the Anthropogenic Global Warming line (toolbox’s like the brain-damaged Hannity, etc, on FNC are simply the exoteric niche, as News Corp is just another oliogarchic support mechanism, at the end of the day), In their bowels of power and message projection at esoteric levels, the truly impactlful social meme creation level, they are reading from the same JP Morgan/Rothschild-approved script.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V75hHFGqcic
@ Max or anyone
If HFT accounts for 70 % trades
Does that mean that the Dow Jones is and actually should be 70 % lower ???
Also if HFT reaches say 90 % is’nt it just 2 Computer Servers havin Gay Sex ??? and it does not represent the real Economy ????
I Just wanted yer take on tis
Hic
The numbers on this site have been declining for awhile now. You might as well holler abortion or gun rights . . . at least a genuine debate still exists with those topics.
31,487 American scientists have signed this petition, http://www.petitionproject.org/ ,including 9,029 with PhDs.
@Fiatmentalist
‘The question is how much of a factor man is having’
You are almost there. Without referencing material from the 1950′s where it is clearly stated natural processes do not structurally change the CO2 content of the atmosphere (except for a very very solw decline), you could simply see there is only one factor that has dramatically changed the last century to affect it. Guess what it is.
One of the big mistakes I constantly fall victim to is that one can change minds using words..
I know HFT comes in miliseconds or nano seconds before a genuine trade but what are the real Figures ???
@Dan II
The operative word is ‘American’..But do you think a person signing a petition against child abuse knows much about it or is in a position to have an accurate opinion on it? You are merely regugitating the shit dished out people that will believe anything if it comes from a source they deem credible. Besides the language of the petition is really poor.
for you http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZCSiAwCEYy4#t=0m4s
@Bonn
Knock knock, helluw? THERE ARE NO REAL FIGURES!!
Stacey, debate this man the next time Max goes on his show–it would be interesting. I would like to hear AJ’s response: http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=alex+jones+global+warming&aq=0
care to read this? http://epw.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?FuseAction=Minority.Blogs&ContentRecord_id=2158072e-802a-23ad-45f0-274616db87e6
@ Mother Earth
Everytang is Recorded on the Dow Jones
Follow the money trail
Aint that Journalism ???
Hic
Monckton’s a fool yet Alex Jones will jump at the chance to have him as a guest. Does this not force you to question Jones’ cred while Max keeps appearing on his shows?
@Dan II – wow, you deniers have a very real problem reading charts and trends don’t you?
I see this with people that shriek every time gold falls in an uptrend
nevertheless, quality matters far more than quantity and I will continue headlining climate change stories for climate, nature and resources are THE ultimate asset/collateral upon which the entire global financial ponzi scheme stands, but for those who seek comfort in Philip Morris financed brainwashing, I can every Sunday post one of their propaganda classics:
and re: your 31,487 petition signing ‘scientists’ (9,029 of PhDs), oh if but one would spend less time signing petitions and just one would do some peer-reviewed research . . . just one, is that much to ask?
Oh, and here are 514 scientists and engineers who have signed a petition rejecting evolution: http://www.nytimes.com/2006/02/21/science/sciencespecial2/21peti.html
If anyone has the time, it would be great to cross-reference to see how many have signed both; I wonder, for example, if Christy, a creationist and Baptist missionary for 27 years, will have signed both?
PS@WE are the monkeys … as Deek explains …
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G5t3j6xQLmY
Best 53 minutes on YouTube ever IMO.
Hope some of you watched him.
@ Stacy
First of all there are 3 or 4 stands on the Climate Change debate
1) Climate Change caused by Humans ( U & Max stand behind tis I guess)
2) Climate change not caused by Humans ( I firmly stand here)
3) The absurd Solution proposed Carbon Credits this is where most peeps actually stand I tinks
Hic
Oh yes we care about Climate Change Plus lets trade it on the Stock market ????? WTF ???? Why ?????
Ooops I broke me own rule I keepin me trap Shut nows
lolololololol
ROFL
Hic
good morninh..hope the aggresion of all parties is a lot less this time.
And still thinking off the scientist who told me he isn’t reaally free to do real research. Because of funding. As a see it with my own body and things which the doctors can meassure and then explain to me that they canmeasure all thing but still don’t know how stuff works.
I think it is the same at large scale. So to all the pro’s and contra’s : Hey…they don’t know!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U9BA6fFGMjI
@Bonn – most people stand in favor of carbon credits? I have just spent much of the past three weeks reading hundreds of articles, scientific papers, charts and bloggers on both sides of the aisle (though only two scientific papers on the denier and/or skeptic side) and I have only ever read carbon credits mentioned on anti-global warming sites and maybe one or two climate change bloggers, I have not once seen it mentioned or discussed by a climate scientist who has peer-reviewed research supporting man’s role in climate change
I would place what I have read as scientists and non-scientists; scientists are, for the most part, cautious, very few speak with much certainty; non-scientists tend to talk more with assertion, Lindzen being the exception, he is the only climate scientist I have read (so far though I am sure there are others) that asserts but has yet to produce one peer-reviewed model or research to back his assertions regarding climate change not being caused by humans; Christy speaks more frequently as a skeptic and less frequently than Lindzen as an absolute denier
@Max&Stacy
I have been your fan and listening to your shows even before you had a show on BBC. The only thing that always bothered me is your fanaticism about MM global warming meme. Please be at least so fair that if you slander a man, that you post his rebuttal of that slander which could be found here.
http://wattsupwiththat.files.wordpress.com/2010/07/monckton-warm-abra-qq2.pdf
I agree with Tofu Charlie. Please have him on your show and debate him there. If he is false you have nothing to fear, and you can remove the mist that has been spun over our peasant eyes by big oil companies, what a service for society that would be. But resorting to saying that he is a nut…. well that just makes me sad and disappointed.
@stacy This is where you are mistaken the ultimate asset/collateral upon which the entire global financial ponzi scheme is based are not those resources. Every gold bug seems incapable of seeing this, they look at gold and they actually see value! it is incredibly short sighted, the miss placed understanding of what value actually is is the cause of this financial ponzi scheme, or you might say ignorance is the cause.
The elitesit knew what the real source of value was hundreds if not even thousands of years ago but today it appears to me that people still cannot see what they knew back then.
This is why I keep explaining how alternative online digital currency’s will be the the future financial system, because if they are aware of it or not they are based on actual value.
Im not going to explain again the source of all value, but you can sit back and watch as these alternative currency’s grow and grow in popularity and the pound euro and dollar simply weaken and weaken.
And as far as climate change goes, yes the climate changes!
Both climate change deniers and climate change activists put a value judgement on what actually IS and try to play God. This planet will do as it will do regardless of your opinion on it.
@ Stacy
Errrrr Emmmmm ……………
……………………
……………
ROFL
Hic
The debate ends now! David Rothschild has said the time for debate is over! If you deny, you’re with the oil companies (even though his family is long oil shares–LOL!)
A great interview–listen to all five parts: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YuNLahhZFJ0
@Bonn – actually, for the record, Nicolas Stern, while an economist and not a scientist, did issue a climate change report / policy paper for the UK government in which he says preventing climate change effects would cost 1% of GDP and he did work for the world bank which has a monopoly on that market and he also now does work for a carbon credit company; but again, he is not a scientist and I haven’t read any scientist (not yet, anyway) that has mentioned carbon credits
@Sir David – Rothschild is not a scientist, nor is Lord Monckton; they can assert all they want for that is the punditry and/or investor method; it is NOT, however, the scientific method
@ Stacy
Errrrr Emmmmm ……………
……………………
……………
ROFL
Hic
I posted tis earlier
Ooops I broke me own rule I keepin me trap Shut nows on Climate Debate
@stacyherbert
Wow, are you setting up a good cop bad cop dynamic with Max? It doesn’t matter if de Rothshild is a self absorbed filanderer that only highlights themes, but could actually do something about it..His adoption of the general consensus amongst serious scientists can be as valid as mine can’t it?
well I learned a new word today – coprophagists.
and now I have, How much is that dogie in the window, stuck in my head.
Thank you Max
Yeah but how did Pier Paolo Pasolini die ? brutally run over ( his own car) ‘its said’ by extortionists who had stole rolls of film from Salò Dead people are no good to anyone.
Jones, Black, Max, Willie, Tavakoli et al need to stay safe
@ jischinger
Max use to use tat werd quite often 6 months back
lololololol
ROFL
Hic
I tink its one of his favorite werds
And now you know why I avoid a debate With Max on Climate Change cause he uses werds that Screw ya mental health fer the Day
lolololololololol
ROFL
Hic
@Mother – I believe @Sir David was responding to my charge that no climate scientist, other than Lindzen, speaks in absolutes; to which @Sir David responded with a link to David de Rothschild speaking in absolutes to which I responded by pointing out that he is not a scientist; I might also now point out that Rothschild has never been found to have fabricated evidence to support his assertions, as has Lord Monckton
You should debate Monckton live on one of your shows, he will absolutely destroy your confused global warming opinions.
Ad hominem appears to be only method of attack from the global warming alarmists. Whatever you do don’t discuss the shonky climate science.
@stacyherbert
I should read the whole tread before responding, I should read the whole tread before responding, I should read the whole tread before responding, I should read the whole tread before responding, I should read the whole tread before responding, I should read the whole tread before responding, I should read the whole tread before responding, I should read the whole tread before responding, I should read the whole tread before responding, I should read the whole tread before responding, I should read the whole tread before responding, I should read the whole tread before responding, I should read the whole tread before responding, I should read the whole tread before responding
And don’t dare type in “coprophagists” and press Google Image search
You’d need 2 weeks @ the Quack Doc to recover
lololololololol
ROFL
Hic
@Mother – ha ha, you should read your whole comment before repeating! tread?
@Stacy
Hey, try to speak and write flawless dutch you arrogant anglophite !
Hindeberg Omen? “a savage equity downturn is imminent,” Bloomberg quotes Albert Edwards, a London-based strategist at Societe Generale SA, as saying.
http://srph.it/ac1box
@Brian – oh boy, in the words of @Tofu Charlie *sigh* do I really need to link to all the science? I will do so next Sunday for you, but, in the meantime, here are a few scientists who have done the work already:
The handful of links above will take you to hundreds of others with research, data and science from real scientists.
But, of course, these links are for those who care to actually read the research. For you, I have this:
we’re never leaving Afghanistan
“1.8 Billion Barrel Oil Find in Afghanistan”
@jischinger – do the math:
that’s 21 days worth of global oil; or about 75 days of US demand
No surprise here. I’ve gotten a whiff of your political flavor often. If you voted in the U.S. election, you probably were so naive as to vote for Obama to receive Change & Hope.
Too bad your flakiness cannot be cured with a good dandruff shampoo.
Well, at least his impact on the UK white colonies has been negligible.
I get the impression that he has no connections outside the UK, so he is at best a UK problem.
QUOTE:
”
JustaPeasant
Aug 15, 2010 at 1:24 pm
@Max&Stacy
I have been your fan and listening to your shows even before you had a show on BBC. The only thing that always bothered me is your fanaticism about MM global warming meme.
”
EXACTLY my thoughts. PLEASE, Max & Stacy, get off your high horses about this shit. YES the world is warming, NO you do NOT have ANY justifiable repeatable evidence that it is man made.
It sounds like Monckton had some god awful eugenics ideas back then, perhaps he’s changed, perhaps he’s still monstrous. Either way it does not discount the true findings in his global warming presentation. the hockey stick, the fact that the middle ages warm period was hotter than any current day record, etc etc..
Come on guys… dont make it seem like you have a hidden agenda with this bullshit. At the VERY least, please please PUBLICLY distance yourselves from the potential tyranny of the cap n trade market bullshit.
dare
Michael Crichton’s last book ‘State of Fear’ begins with sex, violence, a great read all by itself, takes a novel approach to global-warming alarmism (he happened to die after the book came out…….hold that thought, let it simmer).
He started out with the intent to support and advance Global Warming.
It’s not a new book but neither is the Global Warming Institution.
“Crichton has a former alarmist conclude that there are serious things wrong with the environmental movement:
Face the facts, all these environmental organizations are thirty, forty, fifty years old. They have big buildings, big obligations, big staffs. They may trade on their youthful dreams, but the truth is, they’re now part of the establishment. And the establishment works to preserve the status quo. It just does.”
The world governance tyrants need the carbon credit system that will bring in the money and controls, just as they need the world banking monopoly, the IMF, UN, NATO and a collapse of the US Constitution (that is a huge priority of the NWO).
The NWO failed (so far) attempt to implement a global currency would destroy the sovereignty of all nations.
Implementation of world carbon taxes and police will speed up the collapse of the already fragile, crashing developed world economies, the Illuminate are so close, they are wringing their hands.
Come on guys connect the dots.
@dare – here are the scientific rebuttals to all the ‘hockey stick’ myths:
from scientist Michael Mann (including links and references to half a dozen research papers by a dozen or so scientists): http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2004/12/myths-vs-fact-regarding-the-hockey-stick/langswitch_lang/in/
Logical Science on the hockey stick myth with even more links than the above to other scientific papers and responses: http://www.logicalscience.com/skeptic_arguments/fakeddata.html
National Research Council response: http://scienceblogs.com/deltoid/2006/06/nas_report_on_hockey_stick_rel.php
(There are plenty more if you would like)
I’ll just post one response on Medieval Warming, it links to the NOAA statements and also to the original assertion that medieval period was warmer than today; if you want six or seven more links to research and/or responses, I can, however, post those, too, just let me know: http://scienceblogs.com/illconsidered/2006/02/medieval-warm-period-was-just-as-warm.php
Can you please provide me with links to the scientific evidence you have re: hockey stick and medieval period? Thanks!
Analysing Monckton’s credentials and claims about climate
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JfA1LpiYk2o
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XjhTrCgVb5U
Basically, he didn’t do his research and he got it wrong. So why do people still pay him to tell this stuff?
@daddy warbucks
I’m done connecting the dots, and the drawing scares me..
@Jimbo – good point and one must ask why all these scientists allegedly involved in a massive conspiracy to gain grant funds don’t act in their own individual self interest and go work for Philip Morris / Monsanto / Exxon? They pay $2500 per day just to sow seeds of doubt; you don’t even have to do any frigging research or work! CEI was getting millions of dollars PER YEAR from Exxon alone to issue their own assertions about climate change
Seems like a totally inept conspiracy to get involved in just to earn yourself a measly $80-100k per year?
Stacy
Chris Monckton is a top bloke who has eloquently exposed and disposed of the theory that there is harmful or significant global warming caused by human induced CO2 emissions.
You should be working to arrange an invitation for a cup of tea and scones with this good Lord rather than spouting your poorly read views of climate change in the vain hope of denigrating him.
This is where you lose your American patriots readers and listeners because antropogenic global warming is just as much as a scam as the financial terrorists’ scams. It’s all the same program and it’s all Hegelianism to force a one world death and slavery system.
31,487 and counting
http://www.petitionproject.org/
What represents more imminent danger Global Warming or Peak Oil.
@kenja – good question; I’m bit sure, however, that peak oil can be classified as a ‘danger;’ when it does happen, alternatives can be found, even if that alternative is walking to the store or riding a horse
Max and Stacy, your egos have clearly hit the tipping point. The cult of your own personality is obviously too much for you. I agree with your comments about market rigging and manipulation but stick to what you know. How about taking on the fraud that is CARBON CREDIT exchanges, and who the owners and beneficiaries of said rigging operations will be. Why was the ex-Goldman Sachs former Australian Liberal Party leader Malcolm Turnbull so gung-ho on pushing Australia into carbon trading? Couldn’t be because his old alumnists at GS were going to reap a windfall from trading invisible nothings….OF COURSE NOT….THAT IS THE STORY MAX. Wake up. Enough of this global warming shite…oops…I mean climate change.
As an educated lad who has 2 masters as well as an undergrad honours degree in science (biotech and immunology), allow me to educate you with the logic that the ONLY way to stop transmission of disease is though quarantine. Once again, stick to what you know.
People in the Obama bin lyin administration have already come out and said that they will use the Internet; respond in comments, get ‘friendly to government’ web sites on opening pages when you look something up, so it is something to be aware of.
As an example, if you Google ‘State of Fear ‘by Michael Crichton, check out how the Weather Underground (big ObaMAOists) marches out their own PHD’s and other sites so fervently employed to debunk anything that could challenge the credibility of their agendas.
Character assasination ? Gore with his obsession of screwing anything female is even worse. Could we stick to the point please ?
Scientific debate. The truth is still that your scientist tampered with a couple of centuries of scientific data. In science it’s considered a scientific crime.
And the truth is that the BIGGEST AND MOST important variable, the SUN, was complertely ignored. Anyways you never answer the question. Where is all this money going ?
It’s not te soak the rich. It’s to destroy the poor and the middle class. As usual.
@Jeannon – oh no, we’ll lose American visitors!!?!?! http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2010/07/27/american_people_obsolete
Stacy,
the one subject that you and max seem out of your league on is global warning. You continually confuse warming with pollution or toxins or over consumption with a concern about the environment. That report you cite that responds to lord Monkton has already been exposed as an error filled hatchet job.
You can dig through anyone’s past and find things they would not be proud of now – including you me and Max.
The one thing your shows lack are guests who you do not already agree with. There is a “soft ball” element to them. Why don’t you have the man on, if he is a fraud, Max ought to be able to expose him, wouldn’t you say?
@Dare “it does not discount the true findings in his global warming presentation”
What were the true findings? The false ones can be discounted and here’s someone taking 73 minutes to do just that.
http://www.stthomas.edu/engineering/jpabraham/
Monckton has responded to these claims, but not refuted them, although it apparently did lead to the presentation being cut down (though from what I’ve read it may have been to avoid litigation rather to remove inaccuracies)
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/georgemonbiot/2010/jul/14/monckton-john-abraham
@McGold – you have obviously not watched the episode of Keiser Report in which, in fact, we do look at the fraud of the current carbon trading scheme:
and re: your advocacy of testing the population monthly for a non-air borne virus and for quarantining those that are infected . . . um, well, I will let others respond; bearing in mind, of course, that most here were against the vaccinations and scare involving a bird flu
@kenja
Definitevely PEAK OIL. Peak all natural ressources indeed. The carbon credit debate is a racket to enrich Goldman Sachs and JP Morgan. These bastards have devised a new racket, a new derivative bubble to blow up. There are easy ways to settle the problem.
It’s called removing the Saoud USA gangsters frome power and hiking the price of oil to 400$ a barrel and kicking out USA from Central Asia and Irak, Matt Simmins was right about Saudi Arabia. They are a bunch of liars. I think that at 400$ a barrel, that most of the scandalous waste od energy and pollution will subside in 10 years.
It’s the great hypocrisy of people like Al Gore. I haven’t heard him advocating much much higher oil prices to save the planet. As for carbon credit they are a sham and a total fraud like all derivatives.
I do love that every single assertion of myth has been met with a response from me that links to a real scientist with real data and every single time the commenter, who seems wed to the assertion, responds with more assertions often resorting to Lord Monckton, a journalist, has some secret knowledge tens of thousands of scientists and giant institutions with real instruments, decades of data and satellites cannot possibly know because they are all involved in a mass conspiracy to get research funding? again, if you bothered to read even one of the scientific papers, you will see that NO assertions are made from the data that they collection, you will see cautious theory presented, and you will see NO mention of carbon trading by any of the scientists in any of the papers; the only ‘papers’ that mention carbon trading are those that come from journalist extraordinaire, Lord Monckton, and from Philip Morris / Monsanto / Exxon financed ‘think tanks’
its not so much the heat ,,its the humidity…the man with betty davis eyes just another carnival barker..since the 40s the queen of those needin offadontics has grabbed russia reunited germany and now lays waste to the americoned.that island of man prostitutes should be immediately sunk .but alas they will again create civil strife amongst my neigbors
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iLjBOHskEpw
@Stacy
the number of peer review literature agreeing on “scientific consensus about anthropogenic global warming has been in the last 5 years bellow 50%.
Here is a review article about that (we call a review article an article that does not publish independent scientific research, but merely provides an overview of the field).
http://acute.ath.cx/BULK/global_warming/2008-03-cdd.org.-schulte_two_colmun_fomat.pdf
Hope this will talk some sense into the alarmists…
You two should stick to what you know. Man made Global warming is a scam invented to tax people for breathing. It was invented by the bankers ( ie Rockefellers, Rothschilds etc.) the same people who brought us 9/11, WW I and II and are trying to bring us WW III.Tens of thousands of scientists have stated on the record that there is no such thing as man made global warming. The sun has more to do with climate than anything else but try taxing it ! As for AIDs, Lord Monckton is correct about isolating people with the disease. The reason the powers that be don’t want them isolated is because they want people to die and what better way to do it then have those with an infectious disease run rampant among the population and labeled it as ‘racist’ or ‘homophobic’ when anyone mentions that those with AIDs should be isolated. You two need to get a clue.
Ron Paul as an independent draws 13% of the vote to 36% for Mitt Romney as the GOP nominee and 42% for Obama.
I do not see any of Lord Monckton’s devastating arguments against the fraud of Global Warming. You can judge his ideas rather than selected facts about him at his website: http://scienceandpublicpolicy.org/
As for Al Gore’s film, he has written this: 35 Inconvenient Truths
http://scienceandpublicpolicy.org/monckton/goreerrors.html
I do appreciate Max and Stacy but I disagree about Global Warming and about the invasion of the American southern border.
You might have read a couple of weeks ago about the birthday party for a young man at which 17 high school and college age boys were shot to death. The attorney general for that state found the killers. They were prisoners who were temporarily released from prison, loaned government military grade weapons and vehicles so they could kill the 17 young men.
The Mexican gangs have 250,000 employees inside America. They have death squads actively killing Americans. They have killed ranchers including those who leave water out for the illegal aliens who would otherwise have died from thirst.
Phoenix has 50,000 cars stolen every year. They have more kidnappings per capita than almost any city in the world and far more than any place in America. Many of the kidnapped people are found tortured to death.
The Mexican gangs have threatened with death police officers who enforce our laws against smuggling.
Illegal aliens kill 24 Americans every day. Half through drunk driving and half through murders.
Look people, get a grip. There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that there was and is industrial pollution happening on a major scale. However, the AGW crowds focus on Carbon as the culprit is ludicrous. It is a way for Big Business and Big Oil to offload the cost onto the individual via the assinine “Carbon Tax”. I don’t know why this is so hard to see. The major corporations get to buy and sell Carbon Credits, even Carbon Derivatives, and we, the lowly schmucks at the bottom of the food chain, pay the through a tax, the money they use to play the game. By the way, none of this money will ever go to reducing the toxic air and water pollution. Oh, by the way we are carbon based life forms that require CO2 to survive, and they want to declare it a toxic substance. Man that should be your first clue as to how fucked up this whole AGW thing is.
Wow Stacy. Are you getting me mixed up with somebody else? Where did I say anything about advocating “testing the population monthly for a non-air borne virus and for quarantining those that are infected”?
A lot of what you and Max say makes sense but you let yourself down badly when you go along with the “power elite’s” control and tax confidence tick of “Global Warming”. I suggest you read the following from the Daily Bell
http://www.thedailybell.com/1290/Carbon-Rises-Anyway.html
I remember a story a few years ago. A glacier had receded and they found huge cedar tree stumps where the glacier had been, which means of course the area had been much warmer 7 thousand years ago.
http://www.livescience.com/environment/071030-tree-stumps.html
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/10/071030092705.htm
Proof that global warming is “normal”? Who knows, but a warmer planet will mean more rain in some areas less in others. Maybe the Sahara becomes farm land.
“Lord Monckton was the sole ‘expert’ witness the Republicans called to testify at the May 6, 2010 Select Committee hearing on “The Foundation on Climate Science”; note that the Democrats had three scientists testify, not Al Gore and not David deRothschild. I wonder if the Republicans were unable to get any scientists willing to testify under oath what Lord Monckton was happy to do in order to influence US national policy? Perhaps they were unwilling to participate in another infamous moment ala:”
Damn and here I though Republicans/Consevatives/Libertarians/TEA Party were all about taking responsibility for ones actions.
Someone been lying again.
@George Sign – I’m continuously amazed by the slave mentality displayed by commenters on this site; even if in your slave view there is a ‘power elite’ able to control every single thing you do, why the hell do they need to concoct a multi decade plan involving tens of thousands of scientists to come up with a lame plan that at most has been costed at half a trillion per year globally? dang, the banksters go more than that in one day when your frigging measly 401ks were tanking along with the stock market; bankers can take anything they want from you by 9.30am tomorrow morning in a much easier heist in which they don’t need to share the booty amongst tens of thousands of scientists and researchers
@Illinois – interesting, where is that poll data from? Romney seems the GOP equivalent of Obama, good looking and says whatever the audience wants to hear; but will do exactly what Obama and Bush and Clinton and Bush before him did; I think a Paul/Kucinich ticket would be the best, if there were any hope anyway . . . which there isn’t
What do you think about nuclear Stacy, especially Thorium
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2010/08/09/finding-an-energy-common-ground-between-%E2%80%9Cwarmers%E2%80%9D-and-%E2%80%9Cskeptics%E2%80%9D/#more-23238
Finding an energy common ground between “Warmers” and “Skeptics”
And the money involved is a lot more than half a trillion a year.
In the end it will be only words and squiggly lines that back the force that is inherent in dogma: any dogma. Science is not dogmatic. The force will take away our car keys and relegate our existence to a data-driven positing of human agency by bankers and their consorts. We’ll be told that this ‘common good’ is a ‘communal necessity’ while we do not see the life of uber-advantage for those holding positions of authority within the context of the ‘new-world-order’ of multilateral governance over ‘human capital’.
If the AGCW rhetoric is the sell, I say what a silly way to sell slavery. Nazi’s always had the unsavory dig their own graves before shooting the grave-diggers in the base of the neck.
I think a wee bit of protest is in order here. Right?
btw: AGCW stands for ‘and god created woman’. One could see the association between AGCW and the marginalization of science inline with a new religious dogma erupting like a festering sore upon our rhetorical lingo.
@Stacy
What tens of thousands of scientists? Here is a link to a peer reviewed article proving that there is no scientific consensus.
http://acute.ath.cx/BULK/global_warming/2008-03-cdd.org.-schulte_two_colmun_fomat.pdf
His comment on the aids virus was way out of line, however; he has offered openly to debate Al Gore as to which Gore has never responded. Gore’s ” An Inconvenient truth ” was to place fraudulent manmade Global Warming claims in front of the world. His fraudulent hockey stick analysis is a joke ! The International Banking Cartel soon replaced their fraud ” Global Warming ” with the accurate ” Climate Change “, for our planet’s constantly in a change. Manmade ?……you might want to visit Tim Ball ‘s views which shed a different light on anthropogenic global climate change : http://www.canadafreepress.com/2007/global-warming020507.htm
@RJ – no ‘solutions’ before the crisis have any chance of being enacted, so I don’t think about any of them; what I’m fairly certain of if you look at what governments are actually planning is that they will employ geo-engineering when and if climate change becomes too expensive and/or catastrophic; by the way, you can also see from government documents what their response to peak oil will be and that is coal; they reveal their hand in their energy projections where they clearly show coal becoming an increasing share of energy production; and this ties in with the geo-engineering for if they had any plans of carbon credits or things of that nature, you would see in these in their own forecasts
@stacyherbert,
I couldn’t agree more. The whole right-left thing has really crippled this country for over 40 years and enabled the elites to rape all of us. Dad and I agreed it’s time to sell our house of 15 years this coming spring. This was really my mother’s house she passed away nearly 4 years ago. I’m 28 work and still live at home. You will see alot of young Americans doing that in the years to come.
“Oh, good Lord” that was great! Do you know, there is an ass in a see-thru tan dress, looks like a ripe juicy peach opposite the comment box? Geez…like Viagra.
I see them by the dozens, only “dime-sized” instead of “peach -sized” all day long in Shangra-la. But Max…c’mon. “ASS AF”??? Bwahahaha
Stacy: send Sir Alan Greenspan to investigate His Lordship . Sir Alan and Commander McBragg will get to the bottom of it!
@Stacyherbert,
My dad’s friends went back to their school in the old neighborhood on the near Northwest side of Chicago for their 40th reunion last week. When they grewup it was a strong working class and middle class area. Today it’s riddled with gang violence and poverty. My Grandmother lived all 72 years of her life in this area and would just be crushed to see what it has become. This has occured in all of America’s major cities. How are the major cities in Europe?
Dear Stacey
I too am amazed at your gullibility. You obviously have never read the Daily Bell which is slightly more educated than your miss-informed prejudices that are shown in your writings. The major media outlets are indeed controlled by vested interests, or haven’t you noticed this. Max bangs on endlessly about the rigged financial markets of the World so why not the rigged scientific evidence for Global Warming. Stop trying to denigrate people who do not go along with your point of view.
Absolute proof here: Debate over
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDthMGtZKa4
@stacy
There are some exciting developments on the nuclear front
Nuclear is the only way to reduce oil and coal use. Which I would like to see for real pollution reasons. But if more CO2 is a concern for people then they should get behind nuclear. Wind and solar can only do so much. Nuclear is a massive gift to us all.
http://www.editinternational.com/read.php?id=492359d497afa
Hyperion nuclear in a box
http://www.itheo.org/articles/itheo-presents-ithems
Thorium fuji nuclear plants. FujiMini (10 mw) and Fuji (200 MW)
http://www.itheo.org/articles/itheo-presents-ithems
@Illinois – yes, it’s stunning how propagandized the US has become; it’s created this angry, slave society that has no understanding whatsoever of how free they could actually be if they chose nor of what the outside world is like, which, of course, happened to many ex-Soviet empire nations, but it is shocking to see in my own; I have probably already told this story before, but awhile ago, I was at a cafe here in Paris having a coffee and watching an American guy handing out pamphlets to people in the cafe; he gave one to me and it was some sort of evangelical literature; we got to talking and he asked, “where are all the poor people, I was told that they were everywhere here” . . . you know, socialism . . . and he was hoping to rescue all these poor people, he seemed almost disappointed that he couldn’t find any
kucinich is weak .alan keyes would work .but america as a tool of the british empire should be destroyed, we are a nation of the lost.. killing our own for the likes of kissinger bush obama this is just to f cked up to fix,, so ive lost interest in ron paul ..im supportin pol pot ..you all look alike to me and your educated benefit to society is overshadowed by your paracitic nature,,everything you touch everyborder you have drawn leads to death ..
@Stacy,..Some advice,…give up the ghost!
You’re loosing your credibility fast,….. don’t do it ! : )
@Illinois – Western Europe, obviously, doesn’t have US style gang and gun violence; wherever there are cut off estates into which poor people are dumped, however, you see frequent unrest as you do here in France where all the black and Arab people of France’s empire are shoved (and those are well outside the inner city of Paris); mostly it is torching cars, I’ve never heard of 15 or 20 people being gunned down in a dozen different muggings over the weekend, for example; I don’t know about the rest of Europe in terms of what the inner cities are like
Just because you don’t see the poor, Stacy, doesn’t mean they don’t exist. They just don’t have the dough-re-mi to hang out at the cafe dissing Americans.
@Dedo – if I pen a paper calling for testing every member of the population for Aids will I regain my credibility with you?
Unfortunately, people are so afraid of being duped again, they can’t see or admit to a real problem that is right in front of their eyes. Not until global warming is so bad will they finally say “yes, this is real and something must be attempted to stop it from getting worse”
All you Al Gore conspiracy theorists, let me ask you something. Do you think it is even remotely possible that the elites could hatch a regressive global carbon taxing system AND MAN-MADE GLOBAL WARMING IS REAL?
You don’t think it’s possble that the elites have taken a REAL PROBLEM, and offered a solution that hurts the many and helps the few (elite)?
It’s so true that most people are so mixed up, that they don’t know which way is up anymore.
@stacyherbert,
In our major cities over half of the kids don’t even finish high school. We have only 11.5 million manufacturing jobs today compared to nearly 20 million 35 years ago so these folks sadly have no chance when you think about. The mayor King Rich Daley loves to talk about how great the gentification of a few near loop areas has been. The truth is it’s all for yuppies. The only thing they have done is move the poverty out further west in the city and suburbs.
@snoot – I’ve driven across America three times and I lived at the juncture of Rampart Blvd and Wilshire Blvd in Los Angeles, where if the Bloods or the 18th Street gang didn’t get you, the police did (and Max lived in Harlem for five years and that was in the late 70′s); I’ve driven across France and across many of her cities from Nice to Marseilles from the 5th arrondissement of Paris up to the 20th and out to neuf trois; I’ve been all over Glasgow and Manchester and lived in the East End of London; I’ve driven from Istanbul to Antalya and back and I’ve driven from Fez to Essaouira; so, yes, I have seen the poor in both the developed and developing worlds, they exist; this man had bought the lie pushed by Fox News that having things like a society or infrastructure causes mass poverty and serfdom
@stacyherbert,
The sad thing is that many of the people my Dad and my Uncles grewup with blame all the cities problems on Latinos and Blacks. They can’t really see what Wall Street and the elites have done. The GOP for years has played the race card Reagan especially to get people to oppose all social programs.
@Stacey
Is there such a thing as “scientific fact?” Because I always told that anyone that claims “scientific fact” is a scientific fraud! In science, the only thing for sure is that nothing is 100% fact and tomorrow presents whole new set of facts….
@Stacy
You claim no scientist has called for a tax, so if they did would they be discredited?
Well, Stacy, one must look to the Daily Kos to set us free. After all: the application of the two minutes of hate follows some Hegelian apartheid.
Right?
@WL – I said that all the denier scientists and journalist/bloggers obsess over the bogeyman carbon tax rather than the science; I have read hundreds of scientific papers and opinions over the past three weeks and have not yet read one climate scientist that has mentioned it; no, if they called for one, that would not discredit them for that is separate to the science and is a matter of economics and government policy that exists outside the science; again, I was pointing out that it is an obsession of the denier side as is Al Gore, whose name I did not see mentioned once in any scientific research, paper or Nasa or NRC or NOAA data
@snoot – the Daily Kos will not set you free, only you can set yourself free
@Stacy
I could go on and on but…
UN scientists urge carbon tax to fight global warming
It says a carbon price of between $20-$80 (£10-£40) per tonne by 2030 should be enough to limit the expected temperature rise. How such a worldwide price could be introduced will be one focus of the Bali talks. Europe favours cap-and-trade systems, which place a mandatory limit on pollution from countries, companies and even individuals, who must buy the right to pollute more.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2007/nov/17/climatechange.carbonemissions
In late 2008, Dr. Hansen began employing the expression “carbon fee” as a less politically loaded term than “carbon tax.” He has written scores of op-ed pieces and other essays centered around a political program of “fee-and-dividend,” in which 100% of carbon fee (or tax) dividends would be returned to the American people. The most prominent of these op-eds by Dr. Hansen appeared in The New York Times last Dec. 7, on the eve of the 2009 Copenhagen climate summit (click here). A more recent exposition by Dr. Hansen of the same theme, with a critique of the Cantwell-Collins “CLEAR Act,” was published on April 5, 2010 in the Huffington Post.
Scientists Urge Carbon Tax or Cap-and-Trade
from the Chicago Tribune
WASHINGTON (Associated Press) — Ditching its past cautious tone, the nation’s top scientists urged the government Wednesday to take drastic action to raise the cost of using coal and oil to slow global warming.
The National Academy of Sciences specifically called for a carbon tax on fossil fuels or a cap-and-trade system for curbing greenhouse gas emissions, calling global warming an urgent threat.
http://www.americanscientist.org/science/pub/-607
I never indicated I need to be set anywhere, Stacy. I was referring to a figure of speech derived from some longing for utopia inherent to the progressive stance.
Hey Stacy,
Is the TV better in Europe? Escape for a couple of channels it is nothing but commercials and crap here in duh US.
@Stcy
In all of the AGW research you have read, take out the stuff that proves:
The climate changes
humans emit C02
These are not in dispute..
How much research is left that scientifically proves humans cause climate change rather than natural factors?
the tools of devision .we bought into the sugar coated helplessness..the chains of social engineering .rev.al .jesse ..played against our brothers their righteous indignation.. perverse rulers the stirring a pot of unhappiness that they create ..get a rope
Please realize that here in America, any scientist or `expert’ that relies on the government for they income or livelihood can not be trusted. As they will say what ever they are told to say, to keep their job and their income.
I have yet to hear a non-government scientist to defend man made climate change. All independent scientists seem to agree that MMCC is a fraud!
Max Keiser is great when it comes to economics and finance, but he has his head up his ass when it comes to MMCC!
@F.Beard – I wouldn’t want to subject anyone to the television in Italy, it’s far worse than the US for the only option is Berlusconi run television; France is dull in terms of television, all about people speaking proper grammar or having deranged and messy love triangles; the UK has awesome comedy and great documentaries and few or no commercials; Scandinavia is almost all just English language stuff with subtitles in three different languages scrolling across the bottom of the screen
@Stacy,…Bring on the “Lord” v’s The “Keiser” !
Maybe, … just maybe you could “win” back some of your credibility ; )
… France is dull in terms of television, all about people speaking proper grammar or having deranged and messy love triangles;… Stacy
Yep. French movies are mostly lame too. I feel like a man without a country sometimes.
Gore / Monckton – what’s the difference? , in fact, they’re probably working together.
Its not the fact that we should take care of our environment, thats concerns me; Obviously we should.
It’s the system that will be put into place by the likes of either to help us see the light !
@ Stacy
had a nasty night at work, so was a little snippy with my comments, and anyway enjoy baiting Libertarians, wake up this morning to see that you are TROLLING again….you know fundamentally that any time you post these articles a large swath of your more vocal membership is gonna go into a tizzy….maybe this is why you do….to get all the GOLD bugs, Libertarian, or Alex Jones members in a lather to boost your hits….so just sit back and enjoy the ride you shouldn’t have to further bait them by calling out their slave mentality
Because I do believe you know that you ain’t gonna change them….can score quick brownie points by pointing out the illogic of believing in a Dominant Elite that can control every aspect of society needing to engage in this level of subterfuge if all they wanted to do was steal folks property, they can do that with a push of a button like you pointed out…or if they wanted to control them…just wave a cross or flag in front of the majority of folks and cast an accusing eye towards the “other” and the masses will fall into line.
If you take this serious the next time you are on Alex Jones and Max can freely pick the topic as ole Alex says…then pick Climate Change….I believe David Icke on the AJS will talk about Reptile folk before that is allowed to happen
don’t wanna burn bridges right?
why don’t you and Max try The Young Turks? or Democracy Now…because I think you know a large portion of your target demografic is exceedingly conservative, don’t wanna bite the hand that feeds, but you are little trapped in the cage so you rattle it with Climate Change
These type of posts are like beer on a dish to AGWD garden snails..
I think John Stossel ex-lefty liberal, ex-consumer advocate, turned libertarian sums it up quite nicely here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XUlGoaAOzqA
@ Mike
I love Max and Stacy’s insight and is my first ” go to ” website …….great guests……excellent financial and political analysis .
I agree completely with your statement and couldn’t have said it better myself !
@Stacy,
There is no slave mentality in the U.S. because slaves know they are not free. What we have is a consumer mentality. Consumers are enslaved but think they are free.
For example, Milton Friedman told us that we are free to choose, but he did not tell us that we are only able to choose between the choices we are offered. But who decides what we are offered?
And many of us think as long as options are provided, then there is a real choice to be made, even when some of the options are clearly false or illusory.
Climate change deniers are merely being good consumers of a false choice. This is how they assert their individuality, the very urge that makes them compliant to neoliberal/libertarian propaganda.
Wow! The whackjobs are out early. Deck chairs… Titanic. Doesn’t matter what or who caused it, the climate is shifting. Are we prepared to live in a world with less usable agricultural land?
And who is this asshat Brit, and why are so many morons listening to him? I don’t care what he or Gore say. I know what I see in my garden. A plague on all their houses.
@chArles – first of all, all the climate related stories directly relate to finance and markets and the discussion on climate change that you refer to as trolling started with the Moscow heatwave and fires, three weeks into said heatwave when it was announced that the bond market was now being impacted due to 30% of agricultural land being destroyed; as soon as I wrote about it, I got the tidal wave of denying claims; I then asked for links to any scientific proof they had; this has taken over three weeks to go through all the data; and while I had heard of Lord Monckton, I knew nothing about him and have been researching him for weeks now and this is my post; I could give a flying monkey whether it attracts one comment or 100 or 500, and I don’t have a target demographic, whatever that means; as half of our traffic comes from outside the US, we don’t have red team / blue team here; as far as exceedingly conservative following, I have never seen any sign of that; we have quite a spectrum of visits and comments from what I see and read; here is someone reviewing our show today and she describes herself as left of centre: http://madammiaow.blogspot.com/2010/08/keiser-report-splintered-sunrise-was.html
So when floods in Pakistan cause several billion, more than 1% of GDP or heatwaves in Moscow cause damage at more than 1% of their GDP well dang, the US government only admits to 2% of GDP being destroyed by the financial carnage of the past three years; so speak of the floods and fires I will dear boy speak of them I will
M&S,
Please refrain from entering the AGW argument and stick to what you know, financial systems.
@Charles
would love to see Max have Lord Christopher Monckton on but will never happen as the ” Lord ” would ” eat his lunch ” !
What about all the other things influencing the climate (sun) and other gases besides CO2 like methane, water vapor etc. Why is everybody concentrating on CO2!!! Is it because it’s the easiest way to turn the whole climate change thing into a hugely profitable business (Al Gore). Get this into your heads: As long as everything revolves around money and the desire to profit, the ecology will always be neglected.
impotent pencil dicks .you didnt even register a degree of thermal excitation on mother earth .and the grandiose idea of yours to manipulate the global envirement to your liking .pathetic sick,, at best you could nuke it and then with the cockroaches rule ..
Off topic: What’s up with the PMF Rand Paul movie and the Hitler mustache? How idiotic is that? Probably some confused Huffington Post reader that thinks freedom, liberty, and the end of the warfare/welfare state is fascist!!! LOL!
@stacyherbert 1.8 billion in one field on first blush.
and that number keeps going up
@ Stacy – Do you and Max have any plans on making a show about climate change solutions like Fusion energy or other alternative energy that doesn’t cost the tax payers a large part of the GDP and can be market efficient.
“Lord Monckton” is a joke.
Climate change or not:
The ‘elite’ will always find ways to tax the people.
This should stop us from monitoring and improving the air quality.
-The Montreal agreements have helped the fixed the hole in the ozone layer.
(Chlorofluorocarbons and Hydro-chlorofluorocarbons got phased out)
-Catalytic converters help to reduce NOx emissions.
-Flue-gas de-sulfurization is helping to reduce the amount of SO2 emissions in may power-plants world wide.
I guess a lot of people just associate the word ‘emissions’ with
carbon-tax or CO2.
No point to have a discussion with them.
Stacey, I’m a dedicated follower of Truth About Markets. The knowledge and perspective you guys and your guests provide is both refreshing and invaluable. The two of you are modern day Robin Hoods of truth and information; stealing it out from under the rich and sharing it with the poor. But with the all the above praises being sung, I have to disagree with both your perspective and the general perspective of global warming supporters on certain issues.
To lump all those who disagree with man made global warming into a generic pile of ‘climate change deniers’ is false because many of us do in fact believe the Earth has gone through and may if fact still be ‘warming,’ and our ‘climate is changing’ (ie. raising sea levels, melting polar ice caps, etc.) but the main point upon which our two groups disagree and is almost never noted, is the cause. Most climate change believers believe in the anthropogenic idea (as also purported by An Inconvenient Truth) that man’s increased CO2 emissions have been the direct cause of temperature increase. Many labeled deniers, do not agree with the science that exemplifies the above feeling that its doctored and leaves out other scientific evidence that points to the sun’s increased solar volcanic activity as the culprit for increased warming trends on not only Earth but even Mars who’s polar ice caps have been liquefying (ie. the entire solar system maybe warming due to the sun , not just an over-industrialized Earth).
Yes, carbon-based emissions are cancerous, toxic, and unhealthy. Yes daring offshore drilling is catastrophic. Yes industrial waste and byproducts that contaminate our precious ecosystems are detrimentally tragic. Yes deforestation and the raping and pillaging of our limited natural resources are a great threat to humankind. BUT, the argument that this can all be scientifically and socially distilled down to, measured by, and then limited via carbon taxing and or cap and trade is absurdist, and this is why the seemingly petty fundamental argument of the causes of global warming/climate change must still be had.
I’m sorry for leaving out data and articles, but I’d first rather state the counter opinion now and take the time defending it later should this polemic peak your curiosity. For now here are some names which include scientists who have sought and fought to keep their names from the IPCC’s list of backing scientists.
1.) Canadian environmentalist Patrick Moore, former member of Greenpeace.
2.)Richard Lindzen, professor of meteorology at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology
3.)Patrick Michaels, Research Professor of Environmental Sciences at the University of Virginia
4.) Nigel Calder, editor of New Scientist from 1962 to 1966.
5.) John Christy, professor and director of the Earth System Science Center at University of Alabama
6.) Paul Reiter of the Pasteur Institute; former British Chancellor of the Exchequer Nigel Lawson
7.) Piers Corbyn, a British weather forecaster.
The above share in common being featured in the film The Great Global Warming Swindle. A documentary that if you disagree with at least deserves some academic debate as opposed to dismissal and stereotyping of people who do.
We can then get into the East Anglia emails, Maurice Strong, Al Gore and CCX, Prince Bernhard and the World Wildlife Fund, the history of the IPCC, etc….
@Sir David,
What all “libertarians” fail to realize is that all the talk about “freedom” and “liberty” is consumerist propaganda that entices people to voluntarily don the shackles of slavery. Rand Paul does, in fact, support an agenda that must end in a corporate feudal/fascist state. The primary difference between Rand Paul and Ben Bernanke is that the former follows the Austrian School (e.g., Mises) of economics while the latter follows the Chicago School (e.g., Friedman) of economics. But you have to understand that Mises and Friedman were both founders of neoliberalism (aka modern libertarianism), which has brought us to our current situation.
So now everyone that disagrees with you is a climate change denier?
What the hell happened to you guys?
Can’t you see that the carbon credit exchange is just another table at the gulag-casino?
@ Stacy
I know the history of how this little episode started, and as failed mArxist I too can channel any and all of human behavior back into a Market basis…it’s one of the failings of the philosphy which Weber and others have made greathay about
I stand by the statement which I make in reaction to the comments I read on this site in detirmining the political philosphy of members….if you are unable to hear it reflected in comments and believe you have more people with Meps (hope she is doing well) philosophy than say WL so be it….I don’t question the international nature of the comments, which is what attracts me here…but this is a MArket Watch/Finance type of forum and most research show that formula to have ellivated incomes and more conservative philsophies….and I don’t do red State Blue State….I do rich Po divisions….its a personal preference
the Challenge stands though, next time Max is on AJS talk Climate Change…I have written Cenk and posted on The Young Turks site to have Max Keiser on his show, think it would be illuminating for that section of the political discourse in my country to hear what Max would have to say…just as I think AJS target audience needs a dose of Max talking about Climate change
I have to say, Farage, Monkton, they are all opportunists playing the game. Do not get sucked into the slip stream, they will tell you exactly what you want to hear – like the local drunk who agrees with your every word whilst you buy them a drink.
They have zero track record… Farage and Monkton were Thatcherites who believe in trickle down economics – low-life’s who caused misery for millions in the UK. Pro- the Falklands war and the war in Sierra Leone… the one no-one ever talks about. They may (or may not) be correct about the climate… but they are scum.
@Tao Jonesing
That has to be one of the most misguided things ever posted here…
Your argument would work if you excluded the coercion of the State. Liberty includes success and failure. The latter has been subverted by the State to encourage dependency and therefore an exploitative relationship with the State both for corporations and individuals. It is the massive invasion of the State that has enabled the fascism, to blame Friedman, Mises or Rand Paul is like blaming the weatherman for the weather.
The state is the corrupt enabler, a smaller State reduces that corruption but it will never be eliminated. Fascism is unaccountable statism, right or left.
@Tao Jonesing
Troll much? Mises? You had to spell check it, didn’t you, before you wrote it! Give me a break, towelie.
@ this comment
“The latter has been subverted by the State to encourage dependency and therefore an exploitative relationship with the State both for corporations and individuals.”
the STATE promotes dependency? how so? the State is an artifice by the few in order to control the many….the many have no need of the state and could easily overwhelm the few at anytime…the States great hoodwink is to convience the Multitude that it will safe gaurd them against the more voracious and ammoral Few…but it doesn’t breed dependency…actually it is quite contemptous of even providing the most rudimentry of General Welfare and seeks only to insure the Fews plunder
I am convinced that if you removed the State it wouldn’t be the Dependent WELFARE POOR that runs kicking and screaming demanding its return but the coitier class known as the Middle Class that desperately needs it
its a good talking point WL but its hollow….your side of the arguement needs the billy club of the State more than mine needs its Cash payments
Attacking the messenger again. Sigh….ho hum….boring.
The AIDS part was kinda funny. Too bad Monckton wasn’t on the cause for revealing the disease as the bio-weapon it is.
1. AIDS came from a green monkey biting some gay airline steward’s ass.
2. 9/11 was the result of 19 turban-wearing dudes living in caves.
3. Global Warming is caused by SUV’s.
Lovely day it is.
@chArles
You are funny…
just posting a link to the latest Crock of the Week episodes about the heatwave….just for the last image of Alex Jones screaming that the Climate Change advocates want to “kill your children” ahhh reasonable discourse
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LMA9D-ZWwrg&playnext=1&videos=mpB32M_hfCE
An upper class buffoon, rather like our new PM etc.
@WL,
I’ve spent a fair amount of time tracing the history of the rise of modern libertarianism/neoliberalism all the way back to its sources (e.g., Mises, Friedman, Hayek, Rothbard) noting how it morphed and changed over time and especially comparing what the founders said to what they actually did. Simultaneously, I’ve also spent a fair amount of time studying the rise of consumerism and public relations (aka, according to Edward Bernays, propaganda) over the last century.
Based on what I’ve read and what I’ve observed, I have to conclude that the founders of modern libertarianism (aka neoliberalism) intended exactly the opposite of what their rhetoric states, i.e., they lied.
Does that mean I believe that self-proclaimed “libertarians” intend the same thing, that they are liars, too? No. I think they’re dupes, just like the young American women in the 1920s who were enticed to smoke cigarettes because Bernays came up with the idea of calling cigarettes “freedom torches.”
The lie of modern libertarianism is that it proclaims to be pro-individual and anti-collectivism when, in fact, it is very much in favor of one form of collectivism, which is the state-backed limited liability corporation (corporations could not have limited liability without the agreement of the sovereign). When libertarians start advocating the elimination of limited liability corporations, or at the very least recognize that corporations can also be tyrannical, then maybe they can be taken seriously. Until then, I’d prefer to stick with the classical liberalism that the founders of neoliberalism sought to replace.
@Sir David,
Not only did I not need to do a spell-check, I did not even have to consult my personal library of books by Mises.
I remember when Stacey was stumping for Barrack Obama. She fell for “hope and Change” hook, line and sinker.
Now she’s stumping for “hope and climate change”.
Hook, line and sinker.
@Tao Jonesing – Wow! Smartest thing written here all day!!!
My thoughts exactly. I have received no answer to my frequent questions as to why they don’t seem to mind the tyranny of the monopolies you seen in almost every major industry in America.
Anyway, do you have your own site? Or anything you may have written to link to?
Stacy, at first I thought Lord Christopher was one of the many former Doctor Who actors.
@Stacy “Wow! Smartest thing written here all day!!!”
LOL,..I don’t think you are in the position “now”,..to judge who is smart,.and who’s not,..hahahaha
That statement,.after everything you’ve been saying, is absolutely priceless !!
OK, OK, You don’t like Lord Monckton. Fair enough. But, Max, are you ACTUALLY upholding MAN MADE Global warming? If so, can you explain why the ice rings on Saturn, or the ice caps on Mars, were melting there for awhile as Earth was also warming up? ….Seems like all that ‘warming’ is over now.
I was glad to have that pain-in-the-butt Lord speak up against the baloney.
Funny that Max and Stacy who spend entire shows on “The Truth about Markets” don’t seem to connect the dots when it comes to global warming and cap and trade. Relatively few people would even be discussing the issue of warmer or colder (if you are in South America) weather if it wasn’t for Wall St eying the carbon credit market. Wall St sees a $2 to $5 trillion annual market and has pulled out all the stops to convince the world that they have to pay carbon taxes or they will perish. Hey Max and Stacy, doesn’t that sound like the lies these same bankers told Congress in 2008? Wall St’s power is unimaginable. They control the media and the information that comes out to the masses. They also control the research money going to universities which is why scientists opposed to the AGW do not dare speak out in public. They know very well that if they speak out, they will NEVER receive another research grant and their career will be a dead end. The financing of universities by big corporations has meant the beginning of the end for the advancement of science. Wall St has captured scientific research and turned it into another subservient tool to the NWO.
http://www.climatechangefraud.com/climate-reports/7491-official-satellite-failure-means-decade-of-global-warming-data-doubtful
@Stacy,
Thanks for the compliment.
I am currently in the planning stages for my own site and will be generating some content for it over the next few weeks. When I start posting on the site, I’ll make sure that I put the URL in the Website field for comments that I post here.
@Tao – great, keep us posted; looking forward to checking it out
Another tour de force essay from Stacy. Hadn’t seen that quote before about “AIDS quarantine camps”. Wow.
@Tao Jonesing
Wow, yes very good post and clarification. I tend to agree with you except your criticism and generalization of modern tea party/libertarians. Your academic and historically accurate discourse has lost its meaning in any real application today. The left has co-opted the Liberal label, leaving libertarianism the default application. The far right has co-opted the conservatives. People affiliate with libertarianism only by what they are not (modern liberals or neocons). I bet most people if really questioned on underlying values would align themselves with Classical Liberalism. That term is gone to dustbin of history, yet the values remain. In my opinion, bashing and labeling political orphans as Libertarian dupes is a poor strategy and a vast over generalization. Perhaps redefining modern libertarianism since all the others have morphed.
@ martha babson
martha babson writes “can you explain why the ice rings on Saturn, or the ice caps on Mars, were melting there for awhile as Earth was also warming up?”
Well, yes, Martha, actually I can: the sun is slowly warming, as it has been doing for many millions of years. The warming on Mars and Saturn are no mystery at all.
Now back to you: can YOU please explain why, despite the sun gradually warming steadily for millions of years, Earth (unlike Mars and Saturn) has had several ice ages, interspersed with warm periods?
No? Let me help you out…
It’s because Earth (unlike Mars and Saturn) has an atmosphere which is maintained with some fluctuation by the biosphere (which Mars and Saturn also don’t have), and that biosphere keeps Earth’s temperature in balance.
Now that we’ve messed with the biosphere and atmosphere to a horrendous extent, the balancing mechanism has been upset, resulting in the warming that Earth is currently experiencing.
There have been periods of “rapid” warming before – however, previous “rapid” warming has been about 1000 times slower than the current warming rate.
Never mind the politics, tax fears and all the other red herrings.
The Sami have been noticing species of birds that they have never seen before, because they never went that far north before.
The Inuit are complaining that the meat is rotting in their underground “permafrost” fridges.
The pica (a rodent) are migrating to higher altitudes in the mountains than ever before to escape from higher temperatures at their customary altitudes.
The beetles in Yellowstone are reproducing twice a year instead of once, because of warming, then they are eating the pine trees too fast and leaving the bears with little to fatten them for their hibernation.
Russia has banned wheat exports this year because of fires across the steppes where they grow their grain – and Moscow’s air is unbreathable because surrounding peat bogs spontaneously caught on fire and can’t be put out – both because of prolonged drought and record high temperatures.
Does anyone here truly believe that Al Gore has bribed or brainwashed the Sami, the Inuit, the pica, the Yellowstone beetles and bears, the Russian steppes and the Moscow peat bogs?
Truly???
@OneForAll
Now that we’ve messed with the biosphere and atmosphere to a horrendous extent, the balancing mechanism has been upset, resulting in the warming that Earth is currently experienc
Please explain the science behind this in your own words,,
AGW is designed to be a distraction. As we all can see here – it is working as intended. It also has side benefits for much of the PTB in the sense that it contributes controllable heat to the burner that is slowly boiling the frog (us). [This must be done slowly and with care so that the frog does not jump from the water - (for Stacy)] Such a plan is perfect because it contributes to multiple goals with the least amount of input energy. That makes the forces behind it entropic. These forces originate from the peak of the pyramid that most of you have seen in Damon Vrabel’s Renaissance 2.0. These forces are not entirely human, and in this sense you can equate entropic = evil.
I suppose it will do no good for me to repeat: Do the Research!!
@WL,
First, thanks for the thoughtful response. Responding in turn:
“I tend to agree with you except your criticism and generalization of modern tea party/libertarians.”
Actually, today I said nothing at all about the tea party, which I think is dominated by self-identifying conervatives with a few vocal libertarians mixed in. While I empathize with the tea partiers’ feelings of disclocation (I want my country back, too), I fear that they are woefully mistaken about the real source of their misery. While they are correct that the government has played a major role in bringing us to our present circumstances, the government has been directed by corporate monopolies that will become only further entrenched if Tea Party policies are carried out. The Ponzinomics of the Chicago School Libertarians were used to strip mine our economy of America’s future wealth, and the rentieronomics of the Austrian School of Libertarians will make sure the theft is legalized.
“The left has co-opted the Liberal label, leaving libertarianism the default application.”
What is left of “the Left” in America? I don’t see it anywhere. Starting in the 1960s (could be off on the timing), the Left devolved into tiny, uncoordinated pockets of identity politics that each have hamstrung their own political effectiveness. And most of those identified with the Left today (e.g., Kos, Maddow, Olbermann, etc.) self-identify as “progressive” and not liberal. Liberal is an epithet in this country.
“The far right has co-opted the conservatives.”
Yep. Obama is right of Reagan, but he’s labeled a liberal socialist fascist by “conservatives.”
“People affiliate with libertarianism only by what they are not (modern liberals or neocons).”
I agree with you, and that is where the danger lies. Once one self-identifies as libertarian, he tends to seek out others who do, too, and that leads inexorably to places like Mises.org, the Cato Institute and other propaganda arms of the hardcore modern libertarian movement that promote a perverted form of “free markets” intended to disenfranchise us all. The “libertarian” label of this core movement is the first lie: what Mises, Friedman and Hayek created is nothing more or less than the old Right’s answer to the old Left’s socialism. A better label for that core movement is “sociopathism” because it seeks to destroy the superego of its adherents. A sociopath is, by definition, somebody who lacks a conscience, i.e. a superego.
“I bet most people if really questioned on underlying values would align themselves with Classical Liberalism.”
Agreed, which is why we should all reject neoliberalism (i.e., the hardcore libertarian ideology).
“In my opinion, bashing and labeling political orphans as Libertarian dupes is a poor strategy and a vast over generalization. Perhaps redefining modern libertarianism since all the others have morphed.”
Calling people who have been duped by propaganda to align themselves with neoliberalism (aka neo-feudalism) “dupes” is not meant to bash or label but to state a fact. The only way I could be over generalizing is if some people have not been duped but, in fact, seek serfdom through debt peonage. Under neoliberalism, all roads lead to serfdom.
Attempting to redefine modern libertarianism, like trying to improve modern “economics,” would be a wasted effort because so much much of it is rotten and wrong to the core. All we really need is a new label for classical liberalism and the fortitude to take a hard look at the sad reality thirty years of neoliberalism has wrought wielding the concentrated government power that Keynesianism (and FDR) created.
FYI — given the label vacuum, I still self-identify (and test) as a left-of-center libertarian (Milton Friedman is identified by the Political Compass as hard-right libertarian.
http://www.politicalcompass.org/
Here’s the dodgiest of them all:
http://www.thenational.ae/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20100805/BUSINESS/708059888/1005/business
Well, let’s give these guys a little leeway. After all, it depends upon what your definition of “is” is.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China_Investment_Corporation
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/19/business/global/19nuke.html?ref=china_investment_corporation
http://blogs.nature.com/news/thegreatbeyond/2009/10/down_on_the_farm_with_lord_ste_1.html
Lord Stern is part of the real push behind the green agenda: and it’s about sovereign wealth/sdr investment bankrupting the competition through propaganda via the willing press.
The use of Monckton is a way to discredit any real opposition to Wolfensohn’s pet projects.
China Investment Bank:
http://2010.therussiaforum.com/forum/speakers/jean-lemierre/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_L._Thornton
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merit_Janow
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_D._Wolfensohn
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Emerson
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicholas_Stern,_Baron_Stern_of_Brentford
These are the sponsors of our climate change agenda.
http://www.top1000funds.com/news/2010/08/11/cic-no-2-set-for-take-off/
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/politics/conservative/7144801/Lord-Stern-denies-he-will-be-a-Tory-adviser.html
http://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:UU9gMCeA0qIJ:www2.lse.ac.uk/granthamInstitute/publications/Key%2520Elements%2520of%2520a%2520Global%2520Deal%2520-Final%2520version%25201300%252030-4.pdf+lord+stern+lower+population+necessary&hl=en&gl=us&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESgaCJE36x6txJM9TC8n5lok0yGhqMB50fngXPDuqqW8Ke8Rhfc6s72GAmXzC8APe_FSGZADwPVjN-T5V04if__7lXN9QakFyh6YwsC-7oAFaPcxIuGfP2hnTyVwoZ5rrNoNoeCX&sig=AHIEtbQs9lgBLlJbUwgPiMZkjXeHS4Ty3w
Aaahaaaaaa Who owns wikipedia???
How does wikipedia generate $$$$$$ ?????
Hic
@ Stacy
wikipedia also posts tis
September 11 attacks
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/9/11_attacks
Aaahaaaa Got yas
lololololoololololol
ROFL
Hic
PS. sometimes i tink clearer after a couple of Drinks
Hic
Its all Smoke & Mirrors or Propaganda IMO
Hic
I think that’s called attacking the ball not the man. Stick to finance and politics, science is obviously not your strong suit.
oops, i meant attacking the man
Paying a tax on Carbon Emissions is going to somehow magically save the planet- Brilliant! What are they going to do with all the “tax” revenue generated?
Possibly fund some sort of new level of pointless, meddling bureaucracy while adding a new “international” level of taxation on top of the already existing State and Federal taxes? Hmmmmm, could be…..
Cantor Fitzgerald are probably creaming in their pants reading that crappy DailyKos blurb…..
http://www.allbusiness.com/environment-natural-resources/pollution-environmental/6714340-1.html
If you think the Chinese are going to buy into this retarded racket I have a swell beach house in Tucson I’d like to sell you.
p.s. You need to tell Huffington & Kos to take a hike back into Limousine Liberal LaLaLand and hang out with Alex Jones more.
p.p.s. If you really care about the environment, do what I did. I parked my car
and have been doing my daily commuting on a bike
That’s about 70-100 miles weekly on a bike. Plus I lost about 20 pounds and have the chiseled physique of an athlete. w00t w00t!
I hereby challenge any of these “climate tax” gurus to meet me in the hot Arizona desert in the 115 degree summer heat and see if they can match my sheer speed/strength/endurance for the good of the planet
C’mon David DeRothschild, you can do it!
I have received no answer to my frequent questions as to why they don’t seem to mind the tyranny of the monopolies you seen in almost every major industry in America. Stacy
The government backed banking cartel is the chief monopoly in the US. Once that is destroyed then corporations will have to be more accountable or else perish. Why? Because they will have to compete for capital rather than loot it via the counterfeiting cartel.
@Pazuzu,
You make the critical mistake of assuming that those who believe in “global warming” and mankind’s responsibility for it necessarily endorse a carbon tax or “cap and trade.” Of course, this “mistake” is encouraged by Big Oil propagandists, but we’ll spot you that one.
I’m skeptical of everything. Nothing is ever certain, and anybody who proclaims they know what the future holds is selling you a fantasy. That being said, each and every one of us has to make decisions in the face of uncertainty, and doing so requires us to compare the expected utility of the various outcomes. Choosing to do nothing in the face of the overwhelming evidence of global climate change has the lowest expected utility for mankind as a whole, regardless of whether or not you think mankind is partially or fully responsible for the phenomenon. Rational people do not need to insist upon absolute certainty in order to determine that change is necessary.
The fact that I believe that we must address the issue of global climate change does not mean that I support a carbon tax or cap and trade. Indeed, the fact that Goldman Sachs is lobbying for cap and trade tells me that any sane person needs to be against cap and trade. That does not mean, though, that paralysis that benefits the despoiling of our planet is the only option. The reality is that oil is a heavily subsidized and manipulated commodity whose true cost needs to be fully understood and accounted for before we reject alternatives, many of which would prove more “efficient” if we were measuring all of the costs of production and use.
Another way of putting this is that the subsidized and relatively low price of oil already places upon us a “carbon tax,” but it is a private tax that the rentier, oil monopolists count as profits at our expense.
This is one of the most delicious ironies of hardcore modern libertarianism (aka neoliberalism): otherwise rational people are all for paying high taxes to corporate monopolies (that prey upon them) as rentier profits while being adamantly against paying any taxes to a government (that serves them). This everyday, banal and abject display of stupidity makes me empathize with the founders of neoliberalism, who obviously decided that humanity as a whole was not worth saving. I’m nowhere near ready to embrace the dark side as Mises, Hayek and Friedman did, but I do understand why they did it.
@F. Beard,
“The government backed banking cartel is the chief monopoly in the US. Once that is destroyed then corporations will have to be more accountable or else perish. Why? Because they will have to compete for capital rather than loot it via the counterfeiting cartel.”
As to the first point, you have my absolute and unwavering support. The Federal Reserve Act was officially enacted in part to undermine the “money monopoly,” but it actually served to entrench it.
As to the second point, I disagree just as strongly as I agreed to your first point. Why? Because since the Great Depression the money monopoly has rebuilt the institution of economics from the ground up to measure the success of a public company exactly as it is measured today. Public companies are NOT run in the same way as a private business. Public companies are instead run to simulate a financial asset that grows perpetually in an exponential manner that outpaces inflation. A public company can only achieve such growth in less than a handful of ways: (1) through organic growth; (2) through acquisition (i.e., consolidation); (3) through cost reduction (i.e., labor rate arbitrage)’ and (4) through cheating (i.e., anything from timing the date of revenue to stupid accounting tricks to lobbying to change the laws to be in your favor to “off balance sheet” entities, to outright bribery, theft and fraud).
As long as the Chicago School of Ponzinomics holds sway over how we valuate public companies, the looting will continue unabated.
FYI — My current conclusion regarding the New Deal, which I continue to study, is that FDR was forced to deal with an unexpected reality, which is that American industry was already dominated by bank-run monopolies. American capitalism was, therefore, not divided in two (capital and labor) but in three (banks, capital and labor, where banks and capital were already monopolistic). The banks’ dominance of the economy had to be broken (just as it needs to be broken today), but doing so without more would not have changed the monopolistic hubris that led to the Great Depression. Thus, labor was granted equal monopolistic powers as a check against industrial monopoly, while banks (as the least productive of labor) were rightfully relegated to a subservient position to both labor and capital.
Regardless of whether you praise FDR or abhor him, the lesson of the current crisis is that centralizing government power makes it more susceptible to capture by rentier interests. Power needs to be distributed back to individuals in a way that avoids the current barriers to entering the existing legal/regulatory system.
… the lesson of the current crisis is that centralizing government power makes it more susceptible to capture by rentier interests. Power needs to be distributed back to individuals in a way that avoids the current barriers to entering the existing legal/regulatory system. Tao Jonesing
Agreed! I advocate a bailout of the population with new legal tender fiat from the US Treasury followed by liberty in money creation, usage and acceptance. Government money would only be legal tender for government debts, not private ones.
@ Tao
Oil costs around us$3 to $us5 to extract but sells for much more. Oil is anything but low cost to the consumer. In fact the opposite. Hugely more costly than the true cost with the profit going to a select few.
Don’t believe everything you read. You need to be a lot more skeptical.
Energy should be a very cheap item. Nuclear (thorium) is one wonderful option but is largely ignored to keep the price of energy high, for the benefit of a few, but at a huge expense, including pollution, for the planet and everyone else.
@Tao – once again you nail it:
If you read through all the most recent threads involving global warming; you will notice the shocking amount of people who say these words over and over in an almost robotic state; it’s as if they are hypnotized. I wonder what the word is to wake them up?
@snoot – once again you demonstrate the slave mentality operating in so many Americans; it’s always the Supermen who can control all of us masses of little slaves you focus on; you have no free will just fear of mastah; step away from your slavery, girl, step away from it
Why does it not surprise me Stacey Herbert to see you post this hit piece story on Christopher Monkton? Well after making your own personal views on climate change clear in your pro-AGW story last week this character is an easy target for you as he is so easy to make a buffoon out of. Talk about hypocrisy! How about the fact that Max invents high frequency trading then after being paid millions for his creation he spends the rest of his life harpooning the criminals that use this very invention to make squillions doing exactly what he’s shown them to do! I’m starting to smell a rat with you two as you live the life of luxury in France off the back of Max’s algorithms! HYPOCRITRES!
@Nigel – yep, Monckton is a once in a lifetime soul:
@Stacy,… “people who say these words over and over in an almost robotic state; it’s as if they are hypnotized. I wonder what the word is to wake them up?”
I do wonder how you’re sooo sure it’s not YOU who is hypnotized !
How would you know?
All this sniping at one another ! Examination of evidence is key. You need to isolate some issues to discern the truth.
I will offer three points to consider:
The NOAA satellite data, indicating recent warming is in serious doubt. A malfunction with their satellite has caused readings that are probably 10-15 degrees (F) higher than “actual”.
http://www.climatechangefraud.com/climate-reports/7491-official-satellite-failure-means-decade-of-global-warming-data-doubtful
NASA has admitted their own climate data is of questionable value.
http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2010/03/30/nasa-data-worse-than-climategate-data/
Wikipedia and other online articles undermining AGW appear to have been edited and extremely “troublesome” stories deleted:
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=119745
Also note that the CRU data is highly questionable as evidenced in the climategate emails.
So, one would expect that institutions drawing upon this data, like the IPCC, would come to questionable conclusions.
There is actually NO scientific consensus regarding the cause of climate change/global warming.
http://climate-change.suite101.com/article.cfm/no-scientific-consensus-on-human-climate-chan#ixzz0o1PzpVdA
Climate changes, but there’s doubt about the causes and whether we are likely to see a continued warming or another dip like what occurred in the 1970s or the during the little ice-age period of around 1300 to 1850.
Don’t get me wrong. I’m against pollution and environmental damage but I’m also against onerous taxes. A better solution is not to have a carbon tax but to have tax breaks for clean technology (R&D + development).
BTW: I”m in neither camp,..but I do like a good fight,…hehe
As long as I’ve got a fresh glass of water some bread,…and somewhere to lay my weary head,…. you lot can fight between yourselves until the cows come home, for all I care,…. (I’m beginning to wonder if I’ve got some farming blood in me) hmm
“@snoot – once again you demonstrate the slave mentality operating in so many Americans; it’s always the Supermen who can control all of us masses of little slaves you focus on; you have no free will just fear of mastah; step away from your slavery, girl, step away from it”
I never said the Supermen could control me, Stacy. As you well know, I am not willing to bend the knee. The Supermen control the currency system, global trade, and are tirelessly securing control of the food supplies. The system operates from a baseline scenerio indicated through the proliferation of the sdr-index-account-exchange to which the mighty dollar owes homage.
You are extremely condescending in your tone. A bard? A siren? Or a clown? Are you the court jester’s wee-little honey pot, Stacy?
btw: A “girl” I am not.
You know, the thing with pink panthers is… Kuch kuch KOCH uhmmuhm (sorry had to clear my throat.) They are a lot like pink elephants.
just sitting there on the couch in the room. Pfff
So people! When are we going to stop all this insanity?
Yo Pac are we killin’ yet?
SHTF?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xt_BGaDBD2I
hAHAHA TASTY RED PIL
Financial John&Yoko sitting in a tree! bring KRS-1 and it will be a party!
But what kind of tree will it bee? must be buzzing now!
What does this mean?
http://www.revolutionbroadcasting.com/?p=692
@Stacyherbert,
Again, you’re an idiot. Apologize for being too polite to you before. I’ve lost respect. You might know something about finance (MIGHT), but you don’t know anything about this. The worst part is that you refuse to learn.
It’s hard to blame hippies who don’t know anything about this (and that’s who your allies are), but you are constantly presented with links debunking global warming in these threads.
If you choose to stand by your position, please tell me why:
* It’s been hotter than it is now for millions of years.
* Ice caps are melting on Mars.
* And while you’re at it, please explain how a gas at 385 ppm, of which only 4% is man-made, and which absorbs only ~5% of long wave radiation (the kind that is reflected off the earth for the Greenhouse effect), supports idea that ‘global warming’ is man-made? …Again, man’s activity (which didn’t just start in the 2000′s) is responsible for only 4% of 5% of total long wave radiation absorbed. Water vapor absorbs about 90%, and 99% of that is naturally occurring!
It doesn’t make sense.
You can’t address it.
Stacey, I’m fascinated by how you try to discredit the anti-AGW position by suggesting that it is funded by big oil and yet you never question the fact that your position is supported by war criminals and financial terrorists.
Have you ever considered that weather manipulation, which has become the norm in some countries, might be the cause of recent disasters and extreme weather patterns. Considering the fact that the war criminals and financial terrorists that you have befriended are the same people in control of such technology.
We have all learned from your shows how people with the power and control in the financial world don’t know how to stop themselves, treat it like a game and eventually find great pleasure in bringing down the whole system and the lives of millions if not billions around the world. Could it actually be, that climate is suffering the same fate?
If you’re so sure of your facts, invite an expert on to debate it with you. It can be Monckton or someone else of your choice. You keep repeating the same things over and over again while accusing those who disagree with you of doing the very same thing. If you really believe you’re right, you won’t miss this opportunity to prove your point by debating an expert from the other side.
Hmmm… I knew from last year you guys believed that man contributes to global warming. What I would like to know is what the purpose of this “rant” is – I believe this can be called a rant given that it is an attack on someone (Mr. Monctkon) and it pisses you off (well Max shows it more, Stacey you are more diplomatic about your views on this subject, until now that is). Some comments have alluded to your siding with Tao’s ideas and he does have some very smart comments indeed based on the hidden/creeping collectivism that modern libertarians don’t seem to notice. However, their hidden/creeping collectivism is uniting people who have not been served by the left/right paradigm and not in a cause with a common purpose but for to replace the current established left/right paradigm. So in that sense I think the movement is attracting a lot of people who would like to call themselves libertarians but may not understand specifically what it entails, myself included. BUT… there is tyrnanny everywhere. Perhaps Tao raises a good issue. In the cause however, it’s important to prioritize issues, and this issue may not be so urgent on the list but may be a logical next step in the fight to re-gain your country. Or it could be that It just hasn’t been sold with the “urgent! for your attention” tag on it yet. Or maybe we should put out the big flames first? Unless we can know that if this flame is extinguished it will stop the house from burning down.
On the same topic though … broadly speaking I would rather suggest that LM’s observations are quite rational. Apart from his character assanitation of Al Gore.One line that sticks with me though: whether it is more sane to formulate policy around climate change by taking steps to deal with it if and when it happens, instead of pre-empting it (obviously I’m convinced that it isn’t as big a problem as it has been made out to be). Look at Iraq as an example of “pre-emptive” strikes. Anyway, that’s my 2 cents.
Oh and I’ve always advocated lively debate over character assasination. Just a tip M&S – you were very succesful in planting the seeds for character assisination of the various finance power people (e.g. Hank Paulson, Kashkari, G&S et al). It helped that your predictions came true and you are an expert on the subject matter – and that boosted your credibility making it easier for you to take out these guys. Lord M on the other hand…. going to be a tough nut to crack. He’s way more popular than the other guys you took out. He’s presented a very open, logical argument and has ridden the libertarian wave very well. Your Al Jazeera “what do you think” style journalism put you guys in a good spot to get to more hard-hitting shows re finance. Not sure if you’ve followed the same script for the LM /climate change issue.IF you did, not obvious enough. Especially since climate change became a more relevant issue before you guys started to cover it in detail. Plus only a handful of people were paying attention in the pre-GFC days. Can’t say that’s the same for climate change. Doesn’t help that the GFC happened before Copanhagen. Lol.
Gosh… I shouldn’t be giving you guys tips cos I support this guy (LM). Anyways my 2 c. Peace out.
@anybody_who_is_interested_in_science_behind_AGW
SCI article that proves that changes in temperature precede changes in CO2 by 800 years
http://manfredmudelsee.com/publ/pdf/The_phase_relations_among_atmospheric_CO2_content_temperature_and_global_ice_volume_over_the_past_420_ka.pdf
SCI article about how CO2′s relation with temperature increases is logarithmic, meaning that each increase in CO2 levels would bring increasingly smaller increments of temperature rise, and that going from 280ppm of CO2 in pre-industrial times to 380ppm now, would have already produced 75% of the theoretical warming of 1K that would be caused by doubling to 560ppm.
http://www.pnas.org/content/94/16/8335.full
SCI article showing global temperature stasis between 1996 and 2006
http://www.warwickhughes.com/climate/karner.pdf
But who cares about science as long as we can character assassinate sceptics…
WHY HAVE THE DENIALISTS NOT ANSWERED THIS?
Never mind the politics, tax fears and all the other red herrings.
The Sami have been noticing species of birds that they have never seen before, because they never went that far north before.
The Inuit are complaining that the meat is rotting in their underground “permafrost” fridges.
The pica (a rodent) are migrating to higher altitudes in the mountains than ever before to escape from higher temperatures at their customary altitudes.
The beetles in Yellowstone are reproducing twice a year instead of once, because of warming, then they are eating the pine trees too fast and leaving the bears with little to fatten them for their hibernation.
Russia has banned wheat exports this year because of fires across the steppes where they grow their grain – and Moscow’s air is unbreathable because surrounding peat bogs spontaneously caught on fire and can’t be put out – both because of prolonged drought and record high temperatures.
Does anyone here truly believe that Al Gore has bribed or brainwashed the Sami, the Inuit, the pica, the Yellowstone beetles and bears, the Russian steppes and the Moscow peat bogs?
Truly???
Global warming is happening. The animals, the birds and the plants know it: they don’t know about taxes, and they’re not in denial either.
Global warming is man-made. Over millions of years, the Earth sequestered excess carbon – in other words, buried loads of dead things so the carbon couldn’t escape into the atmosphere and cause an excessive greenhouse effect. We’re so clever we dug it up and burnt it, releasing that carbon THAT SHOULD BE SEALED MILES UNDERGROUND.
We have interfered with the natural carbon cycle to a huge extent, THAT’s why global warming is man-made.
I just lose all faith in humanity when I read the stunningly gullible nonsense people proudly spill.
My usual question to deniers (and yes I know they get all uppity about that phrase but skeptics are skeptical because they have LEGITIMATE reasons for being so – and in SCIENCE that means peer reviewed papers, that have survived criticism – and because they know they will lose when forced to play fair they simply cheat by claiming peer review and therefore SCIENCE is somehow corrupted – all with not a jot of evidence except debunked catch all terms like ‘climategate’, NWO, UN, ‘ecofascists’ or socialism – no these people are stubborn to the point of bigotry – and therefore denier is THE term) is WITH PROOF (and yes that would be peer reviewed science) what has caused the warming over the last 30 years (and no it aint the sun). *hold hand to ear and await the sound of pin dropping*.
Next the question what effort have you taken to check that your hypothesis hasn’t got a rational solution (i.e. to are avoiding ‘confirmation bias’: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias) you can check for answers to the most obvious questions:
http://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php
http://www.grist.org/article/series/skeptics/
http://www.youtube.com/user/greenman3610#p/a – click ‘see all’ under the Uploads (47).
Then on consensus there is the fact that just about all the peer reviewed science is neutral or pro global; warming – there is no ‘other side’.
http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/full/306/5702/1686
(and no Benny Peiser’s criticisms have proved groundless – he has backed away to pointless hair splitting).
Then you will present a list of WORLD CLASS scientific institutions that are on your side:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_opinion_on_climate_change
Scroll down through MASSIVE agreement to :
‘With the release of the revised statement[95] by the American Association of Petroleum Geologists in 2007, **no** remaining scientific body of national or international standing is known to reject the basic findings of human influence on recent climate change.[2][3]‘
Then there is the actual CLIMATOLOGISTS – those people who do the science (and yes there a other worthless (and debunked) lists of generalized scientists like the Oregon petition – but here’s the thing when you have say a heart condition you go to a cardiologist NOT a botanist – even though both have degrees in the biological sciences!). So what do the CLIMATOLOGISTS think:
http://scienceblogs.com/deltoid/2009/01/97_of_active_climatologists_ag.php
and this:
http://www.climateshifts.org/?p=5515
Thats 97%-98% agreement!
And I guarantee that STILL the circuits will be slamming shut in the brains of the deniers. This had confused me for many years then found the science to explain it. Robert Altemeyer has spent 4 decades documenting a group of people he calls the ‘Right Wing Authoritarians’. WITH EVIDENCE he shows these people – making up around 20-25% of the population – are equal opportunity bigots (they hate all out groups – though have to be encouraged to admit it), they blindly follow their perceived leaders, use appalling logic to justify their beliefs, are aggressive in the name of their beliefs, and will read/watch/listen to NOTHING that challenges their beliefs (they for example would never dream of looking into this book – oh but they will, GUARANTEED, claim to know all about it and explain why it is wrong – usually with some spleen attached). The free book called ‘The Authoritarians’ is here:
http://home.cc.umanitoba.ca/~altemey/
Take the test yourself to see if you are one starts on page 16/251. BTW it is these blind believers that get behind authoritarian leaders (the leaders themselves Altemeyer identifies as ‘double highs’ they don’t share the followers delusions and are way more calculating – in fact he thinks they may be psychopaths – which also leads me to suggest reading stuff on them e.g. ‘Political Ponerology’ and ‘Snakes in Suits’ are both eye opening -and for me explains the stunning irresponsibility both on this issue and the way the markets have gone). These people are also the tea party crowd according to (the conservative) Robert Altemeyer.
And finally just to hammer home the point. Several more questions:
I bet as a denier you have never read a serious book on the subject – just why would that be? Or are you all knowing and know what the science actually says without any need to find out?
Does CO2 absorb long wave radiation – and if so why WONT the planet warm?
When was the last time CO2 levels were this high?
Why is there less radiation leaving the planet than is entering (this is measured by satellite) something is stopping it.
Why is Venus warmer than Mercury even though it is further from the sun?
Why during the time of the dinosaurs and a time when the sun was COOLER, was the Earth HOTTER?
What caused the paleocene eocene themal maximum? – don’t be put off by the name just google it – it was the last time temperatures shot up and devastated life.
Why is the Stratosphere (warmed by the sun) COOLING and the troposphere (warmed by the greenhouse effect) WARMING?
How did we get out of snowball earth? Here’s a clue:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HG5_ufWfbuk
What cause the end permian mass extinction? The greatest die off in the last 600 million years – another clue (BTW the present predictions of warming over the next 100 years is 4-7oC – be afraid be VERY afraid – also note this documentary has no axe to grind on global warming!):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=scm9DyAMN3g
They have know about the problem for AT LEAST 50 years and the science was basically settled in the early 70′s:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0lgzz-L7GFg
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8547224522119252436#
At 4oC Almost all of Africa – 924 MILLION people, all of China 1200 million, all of India – 1000 million, half of Europe >150 million, most of the US 300 million all of Indonesia 200 million will be come UNINHABITABLE! BILLIONS will be displaced or dead (new scientist thinks 90%!) oh and 40-70% of all the worlds species! Go get a torrent program like ‘utorrent’ then go to a torrent sight and search for ‘New Scientist – 28th February 2009 (Malestrom)’ open the PDF and goto page that shows the world map – yellow and brown ARE UNINHABITABLE – 1/3 of the planet is desert! This could happen by 2060!
Oh and the ‘libertarian’ cornucopians need to explain this away:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F-QA2rkpBSY
And what is to be done about this:
http://www.well.com/~davidu/extinction.html
Go there SLOWLY scroll down and feel your heart break.
Oh and what is Exxon pushing:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_WiTVL9iT1w
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Yz8UwRsWPA
Luntz is likely the reason you doubt so much (if you are a denier) – even he though is stepping away from the DISGUSTING attempt to destroy the world!
Yes thats right they are pushing that there is still debate in the science, that it’ll cost too much and that we shouldn’t act until we are certain (knowing full well that science is NEVER CERTAIN). Now isn’t this EXACTLY what just about every denier shouts out? I am sure it is just a coincidence eh?
Oh and Bush & Cheney (apparently high rankers in the NWO) have been caught lying about global warming – obviously so that they can tax us all then kill us all – obviously so they can get even more taxes out of us – no I don’t understand either but that is what many of the deniers believe:
http://www.desmogblog.com/bush-interference-with-climate-change-science-exposed-in-whistleblower-report
Now I GUARANTEE this will be simply dismissed and either unbacked up name calling will occur or an already debunked piece of Exxon/Koch propaganda will be spilled and the thoughts STOPPED! And we and head towards disaster and we become THE most vilified generation EVER. The Earth needs between 10-100 MILLION years to restore the biological diversity after a mass extinction – TRILLIONS of people that follow us will JUSTIFIABLY look back at us with utter contempt at forcing them to live in an impoverished world.
P.S. thanks SO much to Stacy for making your position so clear – please no not be put off by these people, fighting for action on this issue is probably THE most important issue to face life on Earth for AT LEAST 50 MILLION years!
Chemtrails are real. Chemicals sprayed into the atmosphere by man. Definitely man-made.
I saw these in London (England). About 12 planes spraying on a Saturday morning whilst the sheeple slept and looked into their iphones.