Stacy Summary: Many deniers embrace the IPCC 2007 report prediction that increased CO2 emissions could act as a positive for agriculture. Deniers – oh I’m sorry, ‘skeptics’ – took this prediction of a possibility and ran with it as certainty, shouting from the rooftops about the wonders of ‘CO2 as a plant food.’ Their enthusiasm implying that this were also somehow a good thing for non-photosynthesizing organisms like humans. In the real world, however, this prediction of ‘plant food’ improving yields turns out to be wrong. Higher temperatures, flash floods and extreme droughts are, in fact, devastating crop yields.
For decades, scientists believed that the human dependence on fossil fuels, for all the problems it was expected to cause, would offer one enormous benefit.
Carbon dioxide, the main gas released by combustion, is also the primary fuel for the growth of plants. They draw it out of the air and, using the energy from sunlight, convert the carbon into energy-dense compounds like glucose. All human and animal life runs on these compounds.
Humans have already raised the level of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere by 40 percent since the Industrial Revolution, and are on course to double or triple it over the coming century. Studies have long suggested that the extra gas would supercharge the world’s food crops, and might be especially helpful in years when the weather is difficult.
====
A few weeks ago, David B. Lobell of Stanford University published a paper with Dr. Schlenker suggesting that temperature increases in France, Russia, China and other countries were suppressing crop yields, adding to the pressures on the food system.
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Two economists, Wolfram Schlenker of Columbia University and Michael J. Roberts of North Carolina State University, have pioneered ways to compare crop yields and natural temperature variability at a fine scale. Their work shows that when crops are subjected to temperatures above a certain threshold — about 84 degrees for corn and 86 degrees for soybeans — yields fall sharply.
This line of research suggests that in the type of climate predicted for the United States by the end of the century, with more scorching days in the growing season, yields of today’s crop varieties could fall by 30 percent or more.
Stacy: And for all those pseudo-skeptics who keep using this forum to claim Mars and Pluto are getting warmer so oooh it’s the sun wot is warming the planet (yes, the sun that we have the technology to measure with absolute precision and those precise measurements show no change that would account for earth’s warming). Re: Pluto – let’s get this easy one out of the way dingbats, Pluto’s orbit around the sun takes 248 YEARS, we have been observing it for 30 years, which is not even ONE SEASON; okay, now go back to school. But first, read these items regarding Martians driving hummers on Mars (another meme all deniers spew): Here is a video debunking that argument. Here is info on how a massive dust storm recently warmed Mars by nearly 30 degrees temporarily. And here is info on the effect of the tilt of Mars’ axis on its climate: Mars wobbles created climate swings
The tilt of Earth on its axis varies between 22.1 and 24.5 degrees over a 41,000-year period. That seemingly small variation leads to large changes in the amount of sunlight reaching the polar regions of Earth ? when less sunlight reaches the poles, more ice can accumulate there, leading to ice ages that can last thousands of years.
Mars’ tilt has more variation than Earth’s, wobbling by tens of degrees over a 100,000-year cycle, which can produce even more dramatic changes in climate. When Mars’ axial tilt, or obliquity, has been low, the poles have been the coldest places on the planet, which has resulted in atmospheric changes that can impact how material is deposited.
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I submit for the record..
Robert Shapiro, CEO of Monsanto in 1999
“In agriculture the starting point I think has to be the recognition that the commercial industrial technologies that are used in agriculture today to feed the world, those technologies are not inherently sustainable and they have not worked well to promote either self sufficiency or food security in developing countries and no-one would argue that bio-technology alone is the solution to issues of sustainability in agriculture or food security for the world”
http://www.biotech-info.net/business_conf.html
The Great Global Warming Swindle
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ov0WwtPcALE
1) The planet may not be warming.
2) If the planet is warming, humans may not be at fault.
3) More CO2 and warmer temperatures generally mean more food. Consider the effect of lower CO2 and colder temperatures.
4) If warmer weather is reducing crop yields then farmers can plant earlier when the weather is cooler.
5) If the weather is getting warmer then crops can be planted further north to compensate. Existing farming areas that become too warm can be planted with heat loving crops.
6) The best way to reduce population growth is prosperity. CO2 reduction will generally mean less prosperity.
/facepalm
Live coverage Greece demo :
http://www.protothema.gr/article/?aid=124519
Oh how wonderful satiric Stacy is when she attacks the “skeptics”. I love it, big smile
So we’re back to pollution as the main problem then if I am to understand this CO2 correctly? I can fully agree with that. Pollution is a problem and better, it is something that we actually can fix.
According to Stacy, they drive cars on Mars as well !
Hi Stace
Mars, Venus , Jupiter … oh and Earth as well .. are warming !
Maybe the Aliens drive cars as well ?
@Fishman – that video has been debunked – Read:
http://www.abc.net.au/science/features/globalwarmingswindle/
People who promote the idea of Man-Made-Global Warming are really saying that they want to exterminate vast number of humans in order to saver the planet for an “elite”.
They firmly believe that “man” is detrimental to “nature” and is a disease that should be culled.
People like Stacy Herbert believe in the idea of death being the best course for humans rather than celebrating that life and humans are beneficial for the planet.
It is pure “elitist” propaganda to say that “man” is responsible for bad effects on our planet. They will never admit that “man” is ever beneficial and always want to stop the population from growing.
They also believe that the Sun is just a nice yellow ball in the sky that has nothing to do with warming and cooling cycles of the planet.
Of FFS Stacy get a fucking clue.
Seen various reports on developing nations agriculture that show that huge waste occurs due to lack of proper storage facilities/inadequate infrastructure/vermin etc. Even in developed countries recent estimates reveal about 30% of food ends up wasted. The problem is not so much lack of food but managing its distribution efficiently.
@
The greatest temperature anomalies are in places where there are not many people; the Arctic and Siberia. Methane may be the culprit there, rather than CO2. Not much we can do about that except migrate North.
On another subject: How does “pirate my film work”? Is there an explanation somewhere?
I feel like a character in this Monty Python clip. http://bit.ly/iHDXdI (Monty Python do Max Keiser before Max Keiser.)
Robin
“But new crop varieties and new techniques are required, far beyond those available now, scientists said. Despite the urgent need, they added, promised financing has been slow to materialize, much of the necessary work has yet to begin and, once it does, it is likely to take decades to bear results. ”
What are the odds that any finance will be made available to help this out? They are more captivated by GMOs, gene ownership, profits, control, and depopulation than helping anyone. If the chart in the article is a reflection of things to come, we ought to see 2 or 3 billion people malnourished in a half dozen more years. I really don’t think the leaders want to fix the problems. You heared Bush
Biochar sustainably increases crop yields and sequesters historical carbon dioxide emissions
http://www.biochar.info/
Paul Stamets: 6 ways mushrooms can save the world
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XI5frPV58tY
@Jayme – the only solution governments have is more fascism; their plans are Monsanto and Raytheon (or another MIC company) for geo-engineering.
There is an explanation of PMF at the bottom of that site.
Corn crops in Illinois are very poor. I saw 1 1acre patch that was 3 feet high and the rest were 1′ or less and some may not be planting due to a late start. I feel it will be a very hot summer so those that do plant late may catch-up. Right now it looks bad.
I use Miracle-Gro.
Well last summer I had my worst gardening season ever, my tomato production was down by well over 50%, it was a very hot and dry summer.
Only solution I would implement is to plant in some shade, this way less hours in the full sun will not stress the plants.
‘You heared Bush’ lol
sorry – let that one get away
Bush on global warming
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7408504973132978571#
@stacyherbert – I agree. I have a difficult time when people think we have to ‘do something’ to solve our problems when, doing less is the solution. Governments and companies are made to ‘do something’ even if it’s the wrong thing – imo. It seems to be their only justification for continued existence, along with the horrible wars and environmental destruction.
@Palantír – well, they’re pseudo-skeptical, which is as awful as being pseudo-intellectual; there is nothing skeptical about their myths and fables that can’t even stand up to even a kindergarten science class; I read real skeptics all the time, there is a huge range of opinion in climate science, including as this article above points out, the IPCC in their 2007 report agreed with pseudo-skeptic talking point about plant-food; but, of course, many other scientists warned that the floods and droughts and temperatures would prove to be more negative than CO2 was a positive
@ Stacey
Do you have a position on our new nuclear fall out world?
Fukashima has not gone away and continues bubbling away poisoning us all.
What about the millions of gallons of radioactive water dumped into the sea that is poisoning the worlds food chain?
Or the depleted uranium used and spread like so much peanut butter by US / NATO troops in third world countries.
What about all the other radioactive leaks, reported and un-reported.
The world is being poisoned for thousands of years to come, and yet the deafening silence!
Passion and single mindedness is a powerful emotion Stacey, but it tends to have the effect of blinding the rational mind to all else………………..Z
What role do the monoculture in agriculture play in all this?
@Palantír |
An article on a site accompanied by a pitcture of a woman who has had too many trips to the tatoo parlor is not my idea of a credible critique. As I’ve stated before, if the data were credible – which it isn’t – why did all those ‘scientists’ have to fudge the information and actively try to have contrary ideas suppressed? It’s because this man made global warming crap is just communism dressed up as science. It has no basis in fact. It’s about power and money and about population reduction.
Good points F. Beard.
What if it is learned that global temp. fluctuation results from other factors than man (some have learned this already)?
We could then get on with dealing with these changes in productive ways that would benefit all. As we have it now, our cheerleaders of doom, present company not excluded, will have us whipsawing in true knee jerk fashion all the while provoking us to dance to a tune provided by the global overlords they claim to despise. Makes one wonder just a little.
Again, an asterisk next to MK will be needed as long as he and his are whistling this tune.
Makes me think thrice about picking up some more coinage if I do say.
OK.
Lets all just ignore that small incidental detail of the Solar Max then, and feel guilty that we consume so as to pay ECO taxes, which are redirected towards the purpose of wars.
Someone has dug her heels in, and the “Ladys Not for turning” ……………Z
I’m getting a bit bored with this silly propaganda now. The only one in denial Stacy is you – even Phil Jones from CRU admits there has been no statistically significant warming for over 10 years now.
We’ve just had a la nina event in the pacific (a cooling event in the tropical pacific) which gradually spreads out its impact around the globe. Right now, ocean temperatures at depth in the pacific are once again just starting to cool – indicating the possibility that la nina may once again return this winter.
What this means is that this year and next will continue the trend of no significant warming. How long does that trend need to be before the warmists accept that this catastrophic warming is not going to happen. Sure we might see 1c over the next century (personally I doubt it given the pacific ocean will be in its cold PDO cycle for the majority of this century) – but that’s not something that would be a major problem.
I for one am certainly skeptical SH’s intellect, nothing personal, as you know.
Who was it who said that to be great is to be misunderstood? I’m guessing that man would have also been a “skeptic”.
@sherbert
Pun understood and taken but stupidity is not somtin to joke about. So I won’t do that
But fact is that we live in a CO2 starved environment historically speakin. So maybe the reason is that not enough CO2 has been produced yet to make it realy comfortable here on mother earth for our plant and tree brothers & sisters.
More CO2 when plants are being destroyed is not good. Like more water when plants are not on the land to stop the soil erosion. The ecological balance will do its own Nash equilibrium on us. We may not be one of the players in the new equilibrium.
Ah yes, Ralph Waldo Emerson with the “to be great is to be misunderstood” line. That fits the times. Most of the masses will buy anything these days. Not seeing the forest for the trees. Some thought B.Obama would make a good pres, and said so. Some of these very same people think, or promote the idea that man is causing the planets temp. to rise. Now theres some logic from a skeptic, what do you know!
You takin’ coin from the World Bank?
http://af.reuters.com/article/energyOilNews/idAFLDE75407H20110605?sp=true
@cultamerica – then log off from here and find your greatness on Fox News, they clearly have the greatest ‘broadcasters’ alive on air; right up there with Descartes and Goethe, modern day Galileo Galileis and Keplers they are.
I for one am certainly skeptical SH’s intellect … cultamerica
I’m not. More CO2 will turn out to be a non-issue, a blessing or a small annoyance but it is a PLAUSIBLE problem and people can honestly disagree.
Would you have me a puppet of the dialectical dance? The folly here is of a finer quality. And you all don’t have it all wrong. Just this particular bunk that sticks in my craw. And that bit of being cheerleaders for BO, don’t forget that one F. Beard. I’ve never heard just how such wise and knowing souls could have bought into that.
Always keep one eyebrow up around here, and that works for me due to having one stuck that way.
Is this the source paper for the study by the ECONOMISTS
http://www.columbia.edu/~ws2162/agClimateChange.pdf
If I’m not mistaken, the way to get a theory accepted is to first clearly state the problem so that everyone understands – no one is making this effort. AGW is based on gobbermint data. Who believes this crap these days?
Second, your theory should include solutions. Except the mushroom thing, there is no effort there either. Cap and Trade? Ha! Ha!
Third, the theory should be reproducible. No progress there either.
So you are all are a bunch of loony conspiracy theorists!! (gobbermint and me included). I believe that we have a population crisis, but the solution is death. The medical/gobbermint cartel is taking care of that for you (slow and cruel murder), so I’m not happy with the gobbermint solutions there either.
Another problem is that rich are getting richer – easily proven. Again history shows that all societies – no matter what you call the system – falls into fascism into the end game.
My theory (and solution) is that we should eat the rich. So far, no one wants to experiment to see if my theory is correct. (Don’t look at me, I’m a vegetarian).
Hurrah, Yemen!
And that bit of being cheerleaders for BO, don’t forget that one cultamerica
Is that true Stacy? Did you buy BO’s jive? Well, at least he wasn’t “Killer (Mc)Cain”, I give you that. But I wrote in Ron Paul in 2008. So there, sweety pie.
But now, unless RP wises up to true monetary reform, I’ll sit on my hands come election day. Liberty does not require shiny metals; it requires liberty.
To clarify; one who promoted Barak H. Obama for Pres. of the U. clearly got it way wrong yes? So therefore, this person or people can have future stands brought into question based on that bad call, yes? For M&S to promote Barak in my mind was a fatally dubious. Such a stand should not only asterisk all future calls, it must bring one to question motive. It is then fair to bring motive into the discussion on the warming topic, I mean they do drive it don’t they? And why? It’s not like the globe is not all dancing to the tune already. Why keep thumping away?
Stacy, we love you to bits but Murdoch’s readerships are dwindling because the old rascal can’t help telling fibs, and an article culled from the NY Times is hardly going to convince anyone on here, my dear.
The crop failures are more likely caused by weather manipulation, in line with the planned food control agenda, Codex Alimentarius.
@cultamerica,
To fall for BO was easy. How could a white liberal not fall for him?
And now white liberals will know not to judge a man by the colour of his skin. Poetic justice.
I had little hope for Obama but even less for McCain.
There was clearly nothing other to do F. Beard regarding R.P. Any honest soul not playing the globalist tune, or dancing to this tune saw R.P. as the only voice of reason. Barak was the most obvious tool that I can recall ever having seen, next to Ronald possibly. I mean really! And there was no “lesser of two evil” argument on the planet that could float regarding red or blue, none at all. Those who played this game, and now hold the appearance of outsider status must be called out, imho, aside from all this AGW clap trap.
Sorry to hear that F. Beard, what did BO have to offer other than Centralized Solutions Inc.?
A new FDR, packing not just a new deal, but “the” new deal, the final state solution, if I may.
Maybe more of a Wilson type, setting the table for our new world of order…
crops have never been grown in such great abundance as they are today. if anyone is spreading shit around saying that global crops are failing then you can bet monsanto is lurking somewhere in the background trying to sell you some gmo poison.
but hey, lets the blame the sun, cow farts and pay an increased premium on everything and we’ll still have the same alleged problems.
i have many fields around me full of ripe crops, i have family with plantations in places as far afield as indonesia, kenya and brazil with the same stories of success.
who is having this crop failures-i would like to know…and if some crops are failing i would like to know why, rather than put the blame on an excess of co2. this is more fear mongering to increase the wealth of the rich and those that have bought into the emissions exchange. my local farmers all agree that this is complete nonsense.
mars? dust storms? but i was under the impression that NASA declared there was NO weather on mars…even when dust was blowing up on to the solar panels of its rovers they were still saying that there was no wind on mars.
i have a few friends who develop GMO seeds in a sainsburys lab in cambridge, (they would NEVER eat a gmo product!) but i’ll see if they have heard anything about crop failures and if monsanto has a hand in it. it would be well within the realms of possibility that they might spray the world with a herbicidal hormone to benefit their board.
i cant believe you are still ranting on so shamelessly mz herbert. are you just one of these people who cant admit defeat even when you know youre wrong? how long did it take you to realise that obummer was a complete lying whore? couple of days..? 5 minutes? did you cry at the inauguration?
I don’t know how good colombia is at economics but…
“All estimates indicate strong negative impacts from climate change,…”
@ Stacy
Again here we are with a let’s have a go at the “deniers”… it makes you seem uninformed though you always get on your high horse when someone dares to point out that fact. I am not even going to try anymore … it’s useless. In the end only time will tell whether your and Al Gore were right or if the possibility of Sun/Earth cycles also is a large contributor to the warming. A few of us indicated that please get someone like Piers Corbyn on the show and try to ridicule him … you night be surprised that there is other science out there than what you choose to believe. Also weather manipulation (patented since about 25 years) might be a contributing factor to it all … in the end I would suggest that everything is a business model. You may want to follow the money and see where it leads you …
The only reason that they continue to blame CO2 for warming is because humans give off CO2. That way the population can be blamed for it and therefore they are then able to blame overpopulation for warming and thereby justifying their eugenics program to reduce the population.
There are only about 400 parts of CO2 out of every million parts of atmosphere (their goal is to get it down to 350 parts per million.) Can you imagine the difference between 350/1000000 and 400/1000000. How does 400 parts block the heat from getting past the other 999,600 parts? And if they reduce it to 350 ppm how will these 50 less particles per million make it so there would be no warming? Was it me or you that came down in the last shower?
Why do people who grow dope indoors often add CO2 to the air in their growing rooms? Don’t know? OK I’ll tell you, to get bigger fatter buds quicker. WAKE UP and smell the coffee, my friends.
So much CO2 are we actually talking about? CO2 Contributed by Human Activity: 12 to 15ppmv – Vid
It’s ridiculously tiny miny that I honestly think it’s much better to have much more CO2 to serve the crop best. This also has been scientifically proven beyond a shadow of a doubt unlike all the scientific dribble produced by the IPCC.
Of couse these people like to ignore ‘Climategate’ and go on as if nothing happened. But everybody knows it’s a failed cult, a travesty of science and complete and utter nonsense. They’re psuedo scientists. It’s fraud!
Well something is going on. This is about what is going on with the Missouri flood. Read the comments also.
http://www.weather.com/outlook/weather-news/news/articles/flood-missouri-river-news-updates_2011-0
Northern California is being hit with a deluge of rain. This is highly unusual in June for San Francisco.
The word “unusual” is coming up way to much regarding the weather.
Oliva
Well yourright it’s not only ‘unusually’ dry here in North-West Europe but record breaking.
Bur also ‘Unusually’ many forest fires all over the globe even here, vulcano activity increasing the CO2 levels beyond human’s capabilties which the rats at the IPCC use to falsify their data with. ‘Unusually’ many earthquakes, floods tornado’s and what have you …
Only the faintest idea that human kind is to blame for all this sounds simply to insanely ridculous.
Were marijuana to be legalized and gown freely, it would absorb nearly all of the world’s carbon dioxide CO2. the beauty of this is that marijuana grows tall and very quickly and can be grown fast enough to absorb all of the CO2 that the government wants to tax people on producing, while putting a wrench into the drug wars, saving the government more money, and allowing the people to get cheap medicines and live out a more sublime happy lifestyle of their choice. After all in the US isn’t it the law that Americans at least are allowed to live their lives in ‘Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness?’ What could be more happy than a healing earth and a happy contributor. Ah! Breath in, breath out.
@Youri Carma
I took your advice and watched some of Dutchsinse. He was amazing. He hasn’t posted lately.
One could even suspect the IPCC welcoming these immense forest fires and vulcano’s spewing their gutt to make a point to their insane theories. It won’t work. We’re on to these scumbags now.
@Youri
What is IPCC? Since I can’t find Dutchsince, where is the best place to get forecasts? And do you still have that link for that 20 second video of the road just opening up and swallowing the car?
@Oliva
Yeah, noticed.
Because earth’s climate is mainly driven by the sun duh!!!. It could be entertaining to watch that big fusion, magnetic sucker spilling it’s gutt once and a while.
Very ‘Unusual’ Sun behavior http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zozG4kbIJ4s
Far-side Activity Picks Up: X-class flare/ CMEs (June 4th, 2011)
Monocroping the same plants on the same spot year after year will fail eventually, no matter how great your chemicals are, and how much diesel and water you have. Industrial agriculture as practiced today must, and will, fail.
Our entire concept of agriculture is flawed. Emphasis should be put on soil building and creating resilient ecosystems, with more reliance on perennial species -i.e. permaculture.
These are skills to learn now before you really need them.
Increased CO2 = AGW = crop failures Orwell would be proud
Former FBI chief Ted Gunderson -”chemtrails must be stopped – now”
http://www.cmn.tv/videos/former-fbi-chief-ted-gunderson-says-chemtrail-death-dumps-must-be-stopped/
Chemtrails will fuck up your plants too
Thanks for the vids, Youri. I hope Dutchsinse comes back.
YouTube.com/dutchsinse
i just read defra reports from 1995 regarding action against climate change when even those that believe in global warming talk positively about new species being grown in the uk and current crops being grown further north. quite obvious really. they say that by 2080 my flowers will open 1.4-3.1 days earlier…well, they do that already for years.
i then read an article in the guardian regarding our current drought(2 days of 25+degrees) and everybody is shitting themselves. right now, and for the last 4 hours its been raining here in drought devastated suffolk. apart from the thriving moles my lawn looks fairly respectable. my plants are growing and flowering accordingly, .0078 days too early, and the end of the world looms near as the flubberment promises that i will starve to death, die of thirst, drown in the rising seas, die of e-coli, horse flu, be eaten by tigers that relocated to the new improved UK climate or get squashed by a tractor driver drunk on cider counting his profits from higher wheat prices.
..and regarding the defra report-projections were that its supposed to be 3-5 degrees hotter by …erm last year. i must have slept through that one.
my peach tree was half eaten by a horse today-shook every single peach off it whilst tugging at the branches….or was it AGW on 4 legs pooping fertilizer out its ass disguised as a horse? i’ll ask the editor of what ever neoliberal hopelessness rag m&s read.
Thanks, Kodo. I’ve been watching his channel and today he is finally back!
@Oliva
You don’t wonna know who the IPCC is, their opportunists who get money for shutiing down factories in the US and build them up in India where there are no rules. Ine thing you must know tough banely who is the Kingrat of the IPCC – Pic
You might want to take a look at Piers Corbyn. But is mainly super in predicting the weather on a much larger timescale which again is unusual.
We don’t need usual we need unusual to get further ahead in realy trying to understand what is going on there.
“A video of the road just opening up and swallowing a car” Mmmmmmmm???….. don’t recall I had that Vid tough I do probably know the Vid you’re talking about.
PLEASE check out this ELENIN report:
WATCH !!!
ELEnin Dwarf Star Warning September 26, 2011 – Make Viral!
http://youtu.be/mzaZO1lzioU
ELE = extinction level event
btw, Thank y´all for your GREAT comments here!!!!
@Youri
Never see it coming? Something like that. Now the weather forecast for SF and northern California is getting worse. Talking about a hurricane. Again, HIGHLY unusual.
@vonda bra If there was a large mass as close as the fearmongers say it is then the solar and lunar eclipses would be thrown off now wouldn’t they?
How could this piece of shit cause the earthquakes etc. that these assholes are claiming without effecting the eclipses?
I live in the middle of 500 acres that I do not own they are corn and soy beans and more time is spent fertilizing than planting. My garden is 36 feet times 36 feet and its fertilizer is table scraps and cow poop and every year I smoke the BIG CORPORATIONS HIGH PRICED HUMAN KILLING FERTILIZERS.
Global warming is a scam that we will all pay for via Carbon taxes. Study solar flares and it gives indications of historical rising of tempretures. Whilst I do not dispute the fact that man pollutes and exhausts gases into the air such as sheep that the NZ govt tried to charge for a few years ago. This will be a tool to add taxes and guilt to us downtrodden vestiges.